Abigail
August 12th, 2007, 01:58 PM
Reasons for Converting to/from Catholicism
I've been a "lurker" on this board for a number of years, and recently joined as it was reorganized. I have gained much spiritual insight by reading the comments of others, during a very upsetting and stressful time in my life, and for that I am grateful to all of you who take the time out of their busy lives to be a light for others. I'm nervous about becoming a thread-starter, but what better way to overcome that fear than to jump into controversy with a thread dealing with Catholicism!! :runhills My apologies in advance for the length of this OP, but I'd like to try something different...
As a lurker and as an ex-Catholic, I have naturally followed with interest the threads dealing with Catholicism. I would like to make an observation concerning the negative direction that most of those threads take sometimes. I am most interested in receiving your responses. It seems to me that many people who have "converted" from one Christian denomination to another have had a compelling reason or reasons for doing so. Many times some type of emotionally or physically abusive behavior has been levelled against a person by members of a denomination. At other times it was prevalent un-Christian, unloving behavior. Perhaps it concerned multiple, serious errors in doctrine. Whatever the reason, the person was hurt, and has strong emotions and feelings that resurface when the subject is discussed.
When people are hurt by their churches they feel it deeply and come to boards like this one to sort out their feelings, to search for truth, or with a motivation to warn others from making what they view as mistakes/misplaced trust, etc. I know I did. I feel that threads like these are needed to help our members grow spiritually and to assist others. So, I started thinking of why these threads often take a negative direction, and how to help prevent that...
It is obvious to me that anyone who takes the time and effort to post on a board like this has an above-average passion regarding matters of faith. Through reading the Bible, numerous books, Bible study groups, and this board, I've come somewhat late in life to an appreciation that faith and religion (denomination) are two completely different things. It seems to me that many of the threads that concern denominational differences get derailed on what boils down to claims of exclusivity on the part of one denomination or another. Catholicism, obviously, makes many claims of exclusivity that, in my view, set it up for indignant responses from those of Protestant denominations. Some Protestant doctrines do the same. So...where does this leave us? In an emotionally-charged minefield, IF we are not careful in how we frame these discussions and our own responses. There is also the very real danger of being a poor witness to the many lurkers and seekers who are put off IF a thread degenerates into name-calling, sarcasm, etc. I believe we are in the end times, and as such, I believe that presenting a poor example and witness to seekers is even more offensive to the Lord.
I suppose that a recent study I've completed with my bible study group has focused my attention on the importance of clear communication, especially when discussing sensitive topics. The book was Conversation Peace by Mary Kassian. Have any of you done this study? One of the most important points that the book made was the fact that a relatively small percentage of communication was accomplished by word choice, and that more of actual communication took place via body language, tone of voice, facial expression, etc. Also, the book focused on becoming aware of and sympathetic to the fact that our speech is "decoded" or interpreted by our listeners by numerous factors, such as life experiences, education, a person's physical and mental health, attentiveness, etc. With so many factors in play, it's a miracle that miscommunications don't happen more often than they already do! My point is this: on the internet, we are limited to one facet of communication: our choice of words. Therefore, when discussing emotionally charged topics like a denominational choice, which involves teachings that many here feel decide our salvation and eternal destiny....poor word choice practically guarantees the degeneration of the discussions. The absence of the other elements of communication, and the fact that many of us are strangers until we have posted numerous times on a variety of topics makes our choice of words even more critical, since we cannot tap into usual communication enhancements like a loving tone of voice, smiles, hugs, etc. that convey loving acceptance.
After having said all that, I hope I have conveyed to you all my mindset and where I am coming from in trying to start a discussion on Catholicism in a different way. What do y'all think about beginning a discussion with a succint, clear "testimony" of why you made a personal decision to leave the Catholic Church (OR a Protestant denomination), as a lead-in to why XYZ doctrine is upsetting to you, and why you find it misleading to others, etc. etc. Granted, this is a small first step, but an important one that may help diffuse emotional responses and help us all consider the critical importance of our choice of words.
I'll try to take the first walk off the plank, LOL...:plank
I was born and raised in south Louisiana. Enough said regarding the "Catholic culture" in my life. Loving/supportive parents; Parochial schools K-12; public university; Catholic professional school. Actually taught by nuns as a 6 year old 1st grader that non-catholics weren't going to heaven; remember thinking: that can't be right.... Thank God, I wasn't one of the abuse victims, but did experience, shall we say, less than loving examples in some of the nuns who taught me. We were never taught the bible; only selected scriptures...never a cohesive, in-depth study. I sincerely believe that the lack of a biblical education left me completely unprepared to face trials and crises later in my life, and my faith collapsed, as it had nothing to support it. I was angry at God for a long time. But God was faithful to me; he brought people into my life who encouraged me to actually read scripture for the first time...and I found the answers to my "why's?" The bottom line for me is that the Catholic church has always maintained that they finalized the bible's content, and are the sole source of correct interpretation thereof. If this was indeed true, why have they historically failed to give their people a comprehensive education of the entire bible, and not just selected scriptures? Yeah, I know, I know, I'm gonna get fried with that one...:electric
BUT, it was my personal experience with the practices of Catholic churches and schools in a predominately Catholic area of this country. We moved around quite a bit, so I was in multiple dioceses and parishes, so I can't attribute it to the fact that it was just a bad parish. What value is the church if it fails in its DUTY to impart a thorough knowledge of scripture? This is how we come to know the Lord...through HIS WORD.
The admins are wise in their suggestion to limit the scope of our discussions to avoid derailing threads, so I'm trying to frame this discussion in compliance with that guideline as well as attempting to give you personal background on me that has fueled my opinion, in the hope of warding off misunderstandings, as well as the appearance that I've started a thread as a personal attack or insult. I feel hurt/let down/misled BY the Catholic church. As such, I NEED to work through those feelings and emotions. I NEED to play catch-up big time with respect to my knowledge of scripture. I already have problems with guiding my kids due to my own biblical ignorance, so I try to avoid making further errors by becoming a "Berean" and testing the claims of teachers...see my focus?
If you could pick one reason why you left the Catholic church (or your protestant denomination), what would it be? Try to state a brief testimony of the personal reasons leading up to your dissatisfaction/disillusionment. If you have chosen a particular denomination in its place, please give your reasons for your choice, and why you feel it corrects the errors/omissions of your former denomination.
I've been a "lurker" on this board for a number of years, and recently joined as it was reorganized. I have gained much spiritual insight by reading the comments of others, during a very upsetting and stressful time in my life, and for that I am grateful to all of you who take the time out of their busy lives to be a light for others. I'm nervous about becoming a thread-starter, but what better way to overcome that fear than to jump into controversy with a thread dealing with Catholicism!! :runhills My apologies in advance for the length of this OP, but I'd like to try something different...
As a lurker and as an ex-Catholic, I have naturally followed with interest the threads dealing with Catholicism. I would like to make an observation concerning the negative direction that most of those threads take sometimes. I am most interested in receiving your responses. It seems to me that many people who have "converted" from one Christian denomination to another have had a compelling reason or reasons for doing so. Many times some type of emotionally or physically abusive behavior has been levelled against a person by members of a denomination. At other times it was prevalent un-Christian, unloving behavior. Perhaps it concerned multiple, serious errors in doctrine. Whatever the reason, the person was hurt, and has strong emotions and feelings that resurface when the subject is discussed.
When people are hurt by their churches they feel it deeply and come to boards like this one to sort out their feelings, to search for truth, or with a motivation to warn others from making what they view as mistakes/misplaced trust, etc. I know I did. I feel that threads like these are needed to help our members grow spiritually and to assist others. So, I started thinking of why these threads often take a negative direction, and how to help prevent that...
It is obvious to me that anyone who takes the time and effort to post on a board like this has an above-average passion regarding matters of faith. Through reading the Bible, numerous books, Bible study groups, and this board, I've come somewhat late in life to an appreciation that faith and religion (denomination) are two completely different things. It seems to me that many of the threads that concern denominational differences get derailed on what boils down to claims of exclusivity on the part of one denomination or another. Catholicism, obviously, makes many claims of exclusivity that, in my view, set it up for indignant responses from those of Protestant denominations. Some Protestant doctrines do the same. So...where does this leave us? In an emotionally-charged minefield, IF we are not careful in how we frame these discussions and our own responses. There is also the very real danger of being a poor witness to the many lurkers and seekers who are put off IF a thread degenerates into name-calling, sarcasm, etc. I believe we are in the end times, and as such, I believe that presenting a poor example and witness to seekers is even more offensive to the Lord.
I suppose that a recent study I've completed with my bible study group has focused my attention on the importance of clear communication, especially when discussing sensitive topics. The book was Conversation Peace by Mary Kassian. Have any of you done this study? One of the most important points that the book made was the fact that a relatively small percentage of communication was accomplished by word choice, and that more of actual communication took place via body language, tone of voice, facial expression, etc. Also, the book focused on becoming aware of and sympathetic to the fact that our speech is "decoded" or interpreted by our listeners by numerous factors, such as life experiences, education, a person's physical and mental health, attentiveness, etc. With so many factors in play, it's a miracle that miscommunications don't happen more often than they already do! My point is this: on the internet, we are limited to one facet of communication: our choice of words. Therefore, when discussing emotionally charged topics like a denominational choice, which involves teachings that many here feel decide our salvation and eternal destiny....poor word choice practically guarantees the degeneration of the discussions. The absence of the other elements of communication, and the fact that many of us are strangers until we have posted numerous times on a variety of topics makes our choice of words even more critical, since we cannot tap into usual communication enhancements like a loving tone of voice, smiles, hugs, etc. that convey loving acceptance.
After having said all that, I hope I have conveyed to you all my mindset and where I am coming from in trying to start a discussion on Catholicism in a different way. What do y'all think about beginning a discussion with a succint, clear "testimony" of why you made a personal decision to leave the Catholic Church (OR a Protestant denomination), as a lead-in to why XYZ doctrine is upsetting to you, and why you find it misleading to others, etc. etc. Granted, this is a small first step, but an important one that may help diffuse emotional responses and help us all consider the critical importance of our choice of words.
I'll try to take the first walk off the plank, LOL...:plank
I was born and raised in south Louisiana. Enough said regarding the "Catholic culture" in my life. Loving/supportive parents; Parochial schools K-12; public university; Catholic professional school. Actually taught by nuns as a 6 year old 1st grader that non-catholics weren't going to heaven; remember thinking: that can't be right.... Thank God, I wasn't one of the abuse victims, but did experience, shall we say, less than loving examples in some of the nuns who taught me. We were never taught the bible; only selected scriptures...never a cohesive, in-depth study. I sincerely believe that the lack of a biblical education left me completely unprepared to face trials and crises later in my life, and my faith collapsed, as it had nothing to support it. I was angry at God for a long time. But God was faithful to me; he brought people into my life who encouraged me to actually read scripture for the first time...and I found the answers to my "why's?" The bottom line for me is that the Catholic church has always maintained that they finalized the bible's content, and are the sole source of correct interpretation thereof. If this was indeed true, why have they historically failed to give their people a comprehensive education of the entire bible, and not just selected scriptures? Yeah, I know, I know, I'm gonna get fried with that one...:electric
BUT, it was my personal experience with the practices of Catholic churches and schools in a predominately Catholic area of this country. We moved around quite a bit, so I was in multiple dioceses and parishes, so I can't attribute it to the fact that it was just a bad parish. What value is the church if it fails in its DUTY to impart a thorough knowledge of scripture? This is how we come to know the Lord...through HIS WORD.
The admins are wise in their suggestion to limit the scope of our discussions to avoid derailing threads, so I'm trying to frame this discussion in compliance with that guideline as well as attempting to give you personal background on me that has fueled my opinion, in the hope of warding off misunderstandings, as well as the appearance that I've started a thread as a personal attack or insult. I feel hurt/let down/misled BY the Catholic church. As such, I NEED to work through those feelings and emotions. I NEED to play catch-up big time with respect to my knowledge of scripture. I already have problems with guiding my kids due to my own biblical ignorance, so I try to avoid making further errors by becoming a "Berean" and testing the claims of teachers...see my focus?
If you could pick one reason why you left the Catholic church (or your protestant denomination), what would it be? Try to state a brief testimony of the personal reasons leading up to your dissatisfaction/disillusionment. If you have chosen a particular denomination in its place, please give your reasons for your choice, and why you feel it corrects the errors/omissions of your former denomination.