Once a Sheep Always a Sheep, or Salvation Deficit Disorder?

[PickensSlim]

Please keep in mind that this is during the tribulation. The guaranteed salvation is for members of the church, which is completed at the rapture.
I don't know if believers can loose their salvation or not during the trip, except for the 144,000 sealed Jews.

Slim

[Not Perfect, But Forgiven]

I don't know if believers can loose their salvation or not during the trip, except for the 144,000 sealed Jews.

Slim


Great question. From reading the Word, I honestly am lead to believe the only way a tribulation saint can lose their salvation is by knowingly taking the mark, either because they could not believe for Christ until the end and were decieved, or they got tired of running from the antichrist. I'm glad we're saved in the here and now before the Rapture. If someone gets saved 1 second after, it's already too late, they're in the tribulation.

[readytofly07]

Just so I can understand from what I have read in the previous posts......I know that you are saying that you cannot lose your salvation from all of those scriptures that were posted, so explain to me how someone who is born again, follows the Lord and who for whatever reason (just things happen) falls back into the world...perhaps gets tied up with drugs, witchcraft, sexual perversion and lets just say they at this point denies Christ even after following Him....if he should die or the rapture happens and he NEVER repents for the wrongs that they did once fallen, they are still getting into the Kingdom? Explain that......from what I have just read.....if I went out right now and committed adultery, shot up with heroin, cursed God, stole, then killed somone, and then went under a tree to drink myself to death and having not repented of my recent actions I am still going heaven! Why to me that is saying I can have Christ and have the world also cause no matter what I do I am guaranteed a spot in heaven...yippee...let me live like any ole way I want cause I confessed Jesus is Lord. Now this may sound little excessive, but according to absolute once saved always saved I can go and do whatever I want......now repentance is turning away from your old ways and following Jesus....and for the life of me, I would have to say that if you were truly, truly born again, you would not want to do those things. And I agree, He will never leave us nor forsake us, yet when we completely turn out backs on Him to reject Him once we knew Him, I dunno ......I know one thing, would you want to find out? Just do what you want to do and live any ole way and I suppose we will just have to see one of these days.

[voiceoftruth]

Hi readytofly07.

First without wanting to upset anyone here, what part of the word of God do you not understand with what you have already been shown. It is obvious from what you have said that you either believe that you can loose your salvation or you have been taught in the past that you can loose it & are now having a problem accepting the truth that you can not do so. As I stated in my last post & I quote: With all the PROMISES from God to KEEP you, to SAVE you, to PRESERVE you - to even suggest you could lose your salvation - is to call God a LIAR!
". . .he that BELIEVETH NOT GOD hath made him a LIAR; . . ." 1 John 5:10, please re read all the verses you have been shown.

So to not believe what God has said & he clearly shows beyond all doubt that you can not loose your salvation, you are challenging God to be a liar, or have I miss read your post, but I doubt it!. In answer to what you have wrote, yes you will still be saved after doing all these things. But & its a big but, after doing these things & if you have accepted Gods Gift of salvation in the first place, hence you will have the Holy spirit indwelt in you. You would & will know that you are going against Gods wishes in doing all of the things you state. Just because you have salvation does not give anyone a free ticket to sin, though that is what you are claiming in your post. Though if a situation such as this did happen which I doubt very much, if it did. I for one would not want to be face to face with our Lord on the Judgment seat, knowing that I had done all that I had, when I knew I should not be doing so.

Has anyone got any idea on how that would feel, to be face to face with our Lord Jesus, knowing that they had done all these things. But being in that position to be with Our Lord, all our wishes would be to make him happy & to be able to do so would be to be given our crowns & rewards. So to be there & to have done all you state, knowing he knows it all & to be told that you have earned no rewards, that would be the worst thing that anyone would be able to go through. So I am afraid your statement of what someone could do, just would not happen with a true believer & someone who had accepted Gods free gift of Salvation. I am sure others would be able to put it better than I have. I pray that you are shown the truth before you make a very big mistake.

God Bless you all
VoT

[MillennialSaint]

Great question. From reading the Word, I honestly am lead to believe the only way a tribulation saint can lose their salvation is by knowingly taking the mark, either because they could not believe for Christ until the end and were decieved, or they got tired of running from the antichrist. I'm glad we're saved in the here and now before the Rapture. If someone gets saved 1 second after, it's already too late, they're in the tribulation.

Humph. That's an interesting concept. Never thought of it like that before, but it makes sense.

[bookworm1711]

Dear Voiceoftruth,

Do you have a copy of, or access to, Nave's Topical Bible? Just in case you do, you might profit from examining the many Bible verses given for the topic "apostasy."

Certainly the Bible teaches the absolute eternal security of the believer, not the unbeliever.

It is a very dangerous practice, in terms of understanding the Bible, to fail to take into account ALL that the Bible teaches on a subject!

In Post 4 voiceoftruth cited a most important passage of Scripture, John 3:36.

This verse reads, in the King James Version,


Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

This verse reads in the Revised Version (of 1885, I believe),


Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath eternal life; but he that obeyeth not the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abideth on him.

[Biblenuggetlady]

Just so I can understand from what I have read in the previous posts......I know that you are saying that you cannot lose your salvation from all of those scriptures that were posted, so explain to me how someone who is born again, follows the Lord and who for whatever reason (just things happen) falls back into the world...perhaps gets tied up with drugs, witchcraft, sexual perversion and lets just say they at this point denies Christ even after following Him....if he should die or the rapture happens and he NEVER repents for the wrongs that they did once fallen, they are still getting into the Kingdom? Explain that......from what I have just read.....if I went out right now and committed adultery, shot up with heroin, cursed God, stole, then killed somone, and then went under a tree to drink myself to death and having not repented of my recent actions I am still going heaven! Why to me that is saying I can have Christ and have the world also cause no matter what I do I am guaranteed a spot in heaven...yippee...let me live like any ole way I want cause I confessed Jesus is Lord. Now this may sound little excessive, but according to absolute once saved always saved I can go and do whatever I want......now repentance is turning away from your old ways and following Jesus....and for the life of me, I would have to say that if you were truly, truly born again, you would not want to do those things. And I agree, He will never leave us nor forsake us, yet when we completely turn out backs on Him to reject Him once we knew Him, I dunno ......I know one thing, would you want to find out? Just do what you want to do and live any ole way and I suppose we will just have to see one of these days.

When a person repents, turns from their sinful lilfestyle and gives their life to Christ, the Holy Spirit is sealed in them until the redemption. The "scenario" you give above, I would say the person was never saved in the first place. Will a Christian stumble, yes? Can a Christian live a sinless life, unfortunatly not...but it does NOT give a license to "continue in and habituallly sin". The fruit of the Spirit would convict a believer from such.

[Blackberry]

I know that's something that can't really definitively be answered, I guess I'm just looking for opinions and Scripture to help me out with my thoughts.

My sisters both believe, AFAIK. We all went to the same church after our Mom got saved, and my sisters were involved with church activities.

Both of my sisters are currently living with men they are not married to. One sister has never been married, but has 3 children from 2 fathers. The other sister is recently divorced, but took up with her current "partner" well before the divorce was in the works. Her lifestyle....:ohno

I don't really talk to her much (nor she to the family as a whole), but I am close to my other sister and spend time with her weekly. We were talking Sunday about the Rapture, and she voiced that she's afraid she would be left behind. I have worried about this too....she certainly believes in "the basics", I know that - but she admits to not "living right", and honestly it is not something she could easily rectify, outside of marriage (and she doesn't want to marry the man she lives with, the one who's the father of her 2 youngest children). And so we both worry....is it possible/likely that she would be left?

I appreciate any Scripture, etc that is shared. :)

[gratefulberean]

Living right?

By what standard?

If we had to live right by the Law, God's standard, we would all be toast.

[Witness4Jesus]

We are all not living right... as we are in human flesh and sin. If they believe in Jesus as Lord and Savior that he died for your sins and rose from the dead and sits on the right hand of the Father and will return for the chruch... then SAVED.