Once a Sheep Always a Sheep, or Salvation Deficit Disorder?

[Steve53]

Right, but you're not going extreme enough. The main problem I have is that people CAN be saved and then leave the faith.

Incorrect. Truly saved is truly saved, no if's, and's, or but's.


OSAS says he/she was never truly saved in the first place.

Taken alone, the above statement is accurate into and unto itself.

Someone who is "faithless" now and claims to have once been saved, was never truly saved in the first place. No true believer can ever deny Christ Jesus' sacrifice on the cross. They may backslide but they do not lose salvation.

Your scenario is based on the flawed premise that someone was truly saved (when in fact they were not) and then renouncing Christ thereby becoming "unsaved". You cannot lose that which you never had and Christ cannot lose those whom He has saved.

[Anddra]

Repentance: A word that has two parts:

1- God will forgive you of your sins, and

2- You will turn away from your sinful state

Without repentance, we lose our faith, as we will become lost in faith.

And besides, even if I did switch to OSAS, I would actually live a less strict life (more lackadaisical) because I wouldn't worry about that one time I sinned, or sinning in general. Furthermore, it wouldn't really change anything in my prayer life, as I'd still repent after I sin.


And a question, when do we repent in OSAS?

To answer your last question first - all the time. We repent because we sinned. We repent because we want to enjoy fellowship with God. OSAS is irrelevant to the question. As you stated earlier, it shouldn't change anything about our prayer life. However, I don't see that OSAS leads to a less strict lifestyle.

[Christina]

So God says that if we sin, we are still saved? Then why is repentance needed?:scratch

....because there can be no sin in God's presence. How can you have communication with the Lord if you have open sin in your life? How can you walk closely with the Lord if you have open sin in your life? You can't. Sin will distance you from the Father in your walk and in your communication with him so in order to remove that "wall" you must repent from that sin. Can you not tell me that when you have open sin in your life that you don't feel the distance in between you and the Lord? You don't feel like He's far away from you but when you have repented and asked for His forgiveness, you don't feel closer to Him?:scratch

[Christina]

Repentance: A word that has two parts:

1- God will forgive you of your sins, and

2- You will turn away from your sinful state

Without repentance, we lose our faith, as we will become lost in faith.

And besides, even if I did switch to OSAS, I would actually live a less strict life (more lackadaisical) because I wouldn't worry about that one time I sinned, or sinning in general. Furthermore, it wouldn't really change anything in my prayer life, as I'd still repent after I sin.


And a question, when do we repent in OSAS?

Then that would be an issue you'd have to deal with, OSAS is NOT a license to sin or live your life however you choose. Just remember that by believing that you can lose your Salvation, you are taking away from Christs' work on the Cross, do you really want to do that? Do you feel you have the RIGHT to do that?:scratch

[Christina]

Your scenario is based on the flawed premise that someone was truly saved (when in fact they were not) and then renouncing Christ thereby becoming "unsaved". You cannot lose that which you never had and Christ cannot lose those whom He has saved.

:thumb:thumb

[100knight]

I might get to some more later, cause I need to go soon, but:


....because there can be no sin in God's presence.

This is the basis of the arguments of non-OSAS. IF you are still harboring sin, you can't make it heaven.


And to everyone else: What's the big deal? I don't understand why it's so important? How would believing in OSAS change my belief in anyway except for making me repent LESS. I've said numerous other times, this does(not) make you saved. And ironically, a few years ago, OSAS was seen as a false doctrine.

I'm not mad, or meaning to sound mad, btw.

[Christina]

I might get to some more later, cause I need to go soon, but:

This is the basis of the arguments of non-OSAS. IF you are still harboring sin, you can't make it heaven.

That's the purpose of repenting and if you are truly saved the Spirit will "notify" you that you're not right with God.

And to everyone else: What's the big deal? I don't understand why it's so important? How would believing in OSAS change my belief in anyway except for making me repent LESS.

The big deal is that you have no right to take away from Jesus' work on the Cross. He died for all mankind and he died once and for all, the Cross was the completeness. You can't retain your Salvation by your own works, Jesus' bloodshed did that for you already, that was His job to do. Remember Jesus' response in Gethsemane when Peter wanted to step in front of Him to protect Him, you are trying to do the same thing by thinking that your works are what determine whether you keep your Salvation or not. Jesus paid that price already!



:hug:hug

[100knight]

how does works equate repentance?

Like I said before, repentance is God doing all of the work, and you agreeing with and returning to him

[Steve53]

Quote:
....because there can be no sin in God's presence.


This is the basis of the arguments of non-OSAS. IF you are still harboring sin, you can't make it [to] heaven.

Absolutely incorrect for a person who is born again. Christ's shed blood washes a Christians' sins away completely for now and evermore.

[Philippians1:21]

And ironically, a few years ago, OSAS was seen as a false doctrine.


You are mistaken here, OSAS formed the foundation of the christian belief from the early 18th and 19th century revivals, it has been in existence for hundreds of years.

The view you hold on the contrary has and always will be looked upon as false doctrine.