Once a Sheep Always a Sheep, or Salvation Deficit Disorder?

[100knight]

Please stop insisting people can lose their salvation.


The Bible does not say we are sealed, until we sin, make a mistake or lose our way. This said not everyone who says they are saved, are saved. Some people think that they are saved because they were raised in Church, or they are good people.
Salvation is repenting and turning away your sins. Salvation is not becoming a perfect person.

God saves souls, He does not puts souls in remission.

betty

Okay I see what you guys are saying. We're talking about different people. YOu are talking about Christians, like us who will not give up their faith and are sealed with God. I am talking about those...for example those who are saved (maybe not to our level of fatih) and continually backslide, give in to temptation, etc.

[100knight]

What do you mean by "God changed His plan"? :scratch

God didn't want Israel to have a king, because He knew what would happen. However, they used their free-will and persisted to deny God's emaculate advice. Because of them, God changed his mind.


Becuase of things like this, the Israelites lost their faith.

[sirgak]

Okay I see what you guys are saying. We're talking about different people. YOu are talking about Christians, like us who will not give up their faith and are sealed with God. I am talking about those...for example those who are saved (maybe not to our level of fatih) and continually backslide, give in to temptation, etc.

No, not different people. There's no such difference as you are making. All Christians still commit sin while we live in these mortal flesh-and-blood bodies.

Ask yourself this: how many sins do I have to commit to go to Hell?

Answer: one

Q: What can save me from going to hell?

A: Faith in Jesus Christ.

Jesus saves us from ALL sins.

Here’s a small list of things that occur when we trust in Jesus.

Before we trust, we are spiritually dead.
Eph 2:1 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins,

Upon trusting Christ, we are made spiritually alive:
Eph 2:4-5 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved.

This is what is called being born-again or experiencing the new birth:
1 Peter 1:3 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

We are rescued from the kingdom of darkness and brought into God’s kingdom:
Col 1:13 For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves,

We are redeemed, meaning, bought out of captivity/slavery, and we are forgiven:
Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

We were enemies of God, but now in Christ we are reconciled and blameless:
Col 1:21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. But now he has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation

Our old record of sins is blotted out:
Col 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross.

God justified us, meaning He, the judge, declared us righteous:
Rom 5:1 Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,

God imputed His own righteousness to us, meaning, He credited us who believe with the righteousness of Jesus Himself, as though we were as righteous in His sight as Jesus:
2 Cor 5:21 God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

More than that, God has adopted us into His family as if we’d been born there from the start of eternity:
Gal 4:5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
John 1:12-13 Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.

Every believer is one of God’s kids, and God will NOT let one of His kids go to Hell. Look at the following passage as Jesus speaks as a loving shepherd who speaks of us as His sheep, and that He looks after and protects His flock. Notice that He, Jesus, gives eternal life, and notice please “when” they shall perish (ie go to hell, or lose your salvation):
John 10:27-29 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand.

Perhaps what is confusing you, is the difference between, on the one hand, being saved or lost, and on the other hand, the path of spiritual growth?

One Jesus saves us, nothing we can do, can lose it for us. However, once we get saved, we are born-again, and have a new spiritual life. We are spiritual babies, and just like physical babies, we begin the path of growing up. At any point in life as you meet fellow Christians, you will meet some who are just saved, some who have been saved a while, and some who are mature in the faith. The Apostle John wrote about this in three categories: little children, young men, and fathers:

1 John 2:
12 I write to you, little children,
Because your sins are forgiven you for His name’s sake.
13 I write to you, fathers,
Because you have known Him who is from the beginning.
I write to you, young men,
Because you have overcome the wicked one.
I write to you, little children,
Because you have known the Father.
14 I have written to you, fathers,
Because you have known Him who is from the beginning.
I have written to you, young men,
Because you are strong, and the word of God abides in you,
And you have overcome the wicked one.

Little children, spiritually speaking, are those who are recently saved. They don’t know much about the Lord yet or their Bible, but they do know that God has forgiven them.

Young men spiritually correspond to teenagers. They have grown up some, and beginning to be able to fend for themselves. They’re not fully mature in the faith, but have grown strong.

Fathers are those who have gone through the basics of knowing they are forgiven, have learned from the Bible things about God, and now have deepened in their relationship so that they don’t just know ABOUT God, but KNOW Him. Notice that little children also know Him. There is a difference of depth in that knowing, though. A newborn baby knows who is daddy, but a mature son knows his father so much more deeply than a baby could.

Yes, we can backslide and blow off God, often repeatedly. This is not meaning we are not saved. It is meaning that we have to grow more. Daddy, our Abba, loves us, has bought us through the blood of Jesus, and will bring us safely Home one day, no matter how bad we screw up here on Earth. However, we are encouraged to grow and live righteously by exceedingly rich promises of rewards and glory, such as the five crowns believers can earn while here on Earth.

OSAS is as secure as the strength and power of God:
1 Peter 1:3-5 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

Well, I hope this has helped. Blessings!

[Christina]

Chris, think about it. Anyone who willingly 'gives up God' cannot know Jesus. And if they do not know Jesus, then they were never really saved to begin with.

Exxxxxaaaaaaactlyyyyy:thumb

[Christina]

Every sin is a choice to walk away from God -- every one!



Here, let's correct my wording then....:hehee

One is walking away from God (consciously walking away) and the other is God taking His Saving Grace back from you (losing vs. giving up).....so, of all the people I know of that believe you can lose your Salvation (my husband included) fear God taking back His Saving Grace rather than thinking they can lose it by up and walking away from God. This is keeping in context with 100Knight claiming Salvation can be lost by man making a conscious CHOICE to walk away from God (a denial per se) rather than man losing His Salvation (God taking it away) from unrepented sin.

I don't see sinning as walking away and choosing to give up your Salvation. Sin is something we do because we are weak in the flesh and we have followed the flesh (on an issue) rather than allow the Holy Spirit to lead us. When I sin, yes...I put distance between myself and the Lord and I feel bad but I don't make a choice to give up my Salvation......that's the issue I was trying to address with 100knight because there seems to be some confusion that God won't take your Salvation away from you but you can make a conscious choice to "give it up" because you have free will to choose...thankfully, I don't agree.

[100knight]

So wait, do you guys believe that people who don't believe in OSAS are going to hell?

[Christina]

God didn't want Israel to have a king, because He knew what would happen. However, they used their free-will and persisted to deny God's emaculate advice. Because of them, God changed his mind.

.

Changed His mind about what, what are you saying He changed His mind about? :scratch

[Betty]

So wait, do you guys believe that people who don't believe in OSAS are going to hell?
----
of course not. It is about salvation and not your belief in OSAS

[Christina]

So wait, do you guys believe that people who don't believe in OSAS are going to hell?

I know for me that I'm not saying that. Example...I know my husband is saved and I know he has accepted Jesus into his heart and life. He believes in the bloodshed of Christ and the work on the Cross. He believes that Salvation is through faith in God's Grace......the only downfall for him is that he feels he has to worry about losing it. I don't for a second worry about him going to hell or think he's going to hell just because he's confused on scripture, I just think it's a pity that this "worry" is always in the back of his mind. There is no better feeling than feeling secure in God's Grace and mercy, knowing that I am sealed by the Holy Spirit and never have to worry about losing my Salvation.

[100knight]

Changed His mind about what, what are you saying He changed His mind about?

About giving them a king, no?


I know for me that I'm not saying that. Example...I know my husband is saved and I know he has accepted Jesus into his heart and life. He believes in the bloodshed of Christ and the work on the Cross. He believes that Salvation is through faith in God's Grace......the only downfall for him is that he feels he has to worry about losing it. I don't for a second worry about him going to hell or think he's going to hell just because he's confused on scripture, I just think it's a pity that this "worry" is always in the back of his mind. There is no better feeling than feeling secure in God's Grace and mercy, knowing that I am sealed by the Holy Spirit and never have to worry about losing my Salvation.

This raises another question. How are me and your husband to be judged? Judged by our beliefs or through OSAS?