Once a Sheep Always a Sheep, or Salvation Deficit Disorder?

[Mr. Hill]

Do you figure the thief crucified next to Jesus ever "Spoke Against"? Where did Jesus promise him that he would go?

He was a sinner, but there is no evidence that he had spoken a word against the Holy Spirit.

[Mr. Hill]

Besides, its one thing to unknowingly attribute something that happens to circumstance, but to knowingly attribute it to God's enemy? That is the unforgivable part, but its because God was not in them and they did not know who Jesus was. Thus no salvation and no forgiveness.
.

Any body who knowingly speaks against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgiven.

[OnceWasLost]

He was a sinner, but there is no evidence that he had spoken a word against the Holy Spirit.

Did you bother to read the Greek tense of the verb upon which your whole argument hinges? I posted it above, and it does not say what you say it does. Correct exegesis of the verse shows it is a future permanent situation. (AKA assuming room temp.)

[Mr. Hill]

And the point about sorrow is that if you are scared that you have committed the unforgivable sin: then you HAVEN'T.
That is speculation though. There is no evidence that


The only sin that cannot be forgiven is the sin you don't want forgiveness for, which is what the Pharisees demonstrated in front of Jesus. And I have made the case that Holy Spirit must be blasphemed the same way that God is worshipped: IN SPIRIT.

To blaspheme against the Holy Spirit is to commit a one-time sin that cannot be forgiven, whether by speaking the word or by doing it in spirit.


Also: The Bible says there is A sin unto death, NOT several.

The Bible doesn't say what exactly the sin unto death actually is.


The point of the matter is: If salvation could be lost, all Satan would have to do is trick humans into sinning, then kill them and Christ is defeated.

I believe that that is exactly what Satan tries to do.


You seem to ignore Ephesians 2:8-9, which clearly state that we are saved by grace an not anything of ourselves, as well as John 10:28-29, which CLEARLY states NO ONE can take us out of Christ's hands, or the Father's hands.

It says that nobody can snatch us out of His hands, not that a person can't choose to leave. Ephesians 2:8-9 means simply that we can't earn forgiveness for past sins. It doesn't necesarily mean that present or future sins are forgiven before they are committed.

[Mr. Hill]

and you say you did that so you are saying you are unforgiven and cannot be forgiven, right?
therefore, you are not going to heaven correct?

Right.

[Robert]

That is speculation though. There is no evidence that

Wrong. I mentioned already about Godly sorrow, as said by Paul. And you are forgetting 1 John 1:9 and 2:1-2, unless you think John was full of it. In fact, read all of chapter 1 and 2 in 1 John and you will see it clearly displayed. Putting them together, you see that God's mercy is not fickle.


And you should be reading the entire passages of scripture as i have posted, not single verses that can be manipulated out of context.




To blaspheme against the Holy Spirit is to commit a one-time sin that cannot be forgiven, whether by speaking the word or by doing it in spirit.

I made my case using scripture, and using the original greek at that. You have not made yours.



The Bible doesn't say what exactly the sin unto death actually is.

It says there is A sin unto death, not a bunch of them. Since there is only one, it has to be the same one throughout all the quoted verses. God doesn't trick people, nor does he pull the rug out from under them like you are insinuating, Mr. Hill.




I believe that that is exactly what Satan tries to do.

The Satan would have defeated God a long time ago, and he hasn't done that yet. Do you honestly think God is going to send his son to die for us, and then leave it up to our ability to not sin in order to keep us saved? You forget Ephesians 2:8-9, and in fact the whole chapter.



It says that nobody can snatch us out of His hands, not that a person can't choose to leave. Ephesians 2:8-9 means simply that we can't earn forgiveness for past sins. It doesn't necessarily mean that present or future sins are forgiven before they are committed.

If that were the case, then none of anyone's sins could be forgiven, because after Christ died on the cross, ALL sins were future. Not to mention that YOU are SOMEONE. And if you are someone, then NOBODY would HAVE to include YOU. If it didn't, God would have been very specific; he doesn't play games.

[Robert]

Right.

Then why are you here? You say that you committed the "unforgivable sin". If that is so, why are you trying so hard to convince others that they are no longer saved?

[CID03]

Then why are you here? You say that you committed the "unforgivable sin". If that is so, why are you trying so hard to convince others that they are no longer saved?

Thats what I was getting ready to ask..

[Mr. Hill]

Then why are you here? You say that you committed the "unforgivable sin". If that is so, why are you trying so hard to convince others that they are no longer saved?

I'm not. Very few people have spoken directly against the Spirit of God the way the Pharisees did.

And for those who haven't, DON'T DO IT!

[HeIsEnough]

Then this conversation is done for you. You need to go before the Lord in prayer about this for a while.