Once a Sheep Always a Sheep, or Salvation Deficit Disorder?

[goinghome]

I agree with LaMontre and the others, but I would add one thing. When someone appears to be saved, and then goes back to their old ways and says they no longer believe, chances are they never really believed in the first place. Lots of fakers out there. Sometimes it takes a while for things to sink into our hearts. Or sometimes we profess to believe in order to get a material or emotional need met, and it's not a genuine love of god. SO, to me, it's more like ORSAS, Once REALLY Saved Always Saved.

[graceforme]

Not only are there lots of "fakers" out there, but there are also those who have been deceived into thinking that they are saved because they attend church, give money, sing in the choir, etc. They have never had a heart-changing salvation experience, but they have been fooled into thinking they are saved because of their works.
Once REALLY saved, always saved - I like that. I like to think of it this way - No one can convince me that the blood that was strong enough to save me is not strong enough to KEEP me saved. If Christ's blood can't keep me saved, then His suffering on the Cross was for nothing. OSAS ALL THE WAY!

[ddg1263]

This is my take on once saved always saved.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark%204%20;&version=31;


Mark 4
The Parable of the Sower
1Again Jesus began to teach by the lake. The crowd that gathered around him was so large that he got into a boat and sat in it out on the lake, while all the people were along the shore at the water's edge. 2He taught them many things by parables, and in his teaching said: 3"Listen! A farmer went out to sow his seed. 4As he was scattering the seed, some fell along the path, and the birds came and ate it up. 5Some fell on rocky places, where it did not have much soil. It sprang up quickly, because the soil was shallow. 6But when the sun came up, the plants were scorched, and they withered because they had no root. 7Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants, so that they did not bear grain. 8Still other seed fell on good soil. It came up, grew and produced a crop, multiplying thirty, sixty, or even a hundred times."
9Then Jesus said, "He who has ears to hear, let him hear."

10When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. 11He told them, "The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables 12so that,
" 'they may be ever seeing but never perceiving,
and ever hearing but never understanding;
otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!'[a]"

13Then Jesus said to them, "Don't you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable? 14The farmer sows the word. 15Some people are like seed along the path, where the word is sown. As soon as they hear it, Satan comes and takes away the word that was sown in them. 16Others, like seed sown on rocky places, hear the word and at once receive it with joy. 17But since they have no root, they last only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, they quickly fall away. 18Still others, like seed sown among thorns, hear the word; 19but the worries of this life, the deceitfulness of wealth and the desires for other things come in and choke the word, making it unfruitful. 20Others, like seed sown on good soil, hear the word, accept it, and produce a crop—thirty, sixty or even a hundred times what was sown."

I believe it happens JUST like Jesus told us, and the fruits you produce are a life long experience with the lord. And Satan does come try to throw thorns in your life to try and stop the tree from growing.

[Jany]

Paul, writing to the Ephesians, says that "the Gentiles [that’s us] are fellow heirs and fellow members of the body, and fellow partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel." ( Read also Galatians 4:4-6.) It must be understood that our security in Christ only comes through true confession, repentance and accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior.

Some passages that confirm our security in Jesus Christ:

John 10:27-28: "My sheep [that’s us] hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me, and I give eternal life to them, and they shall never perish; and no one shall snatch them out of My hand."

Notice Jesus’ words "shall never perish" and "shall not snatch." These are imperatives!

Romans 8:35, 38-39: "Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?… For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."

1 John 5:18:

"We know that no one who is born of God sins; but he who is born of God keeps him and the evil one does not touch him."

Not even Satan can snatch us our of God’s hand! <><

[Jesse]

I was wondering what many people thought about the once saved always saved ? I would like to hear your reason's and why its biblical or unbiblical followed with scripture.

Here are some articles that I wrote on the subject:

Is Eternal Life a License To Sin? (http://members.tripod.com/jdlarsenmn/eternal_security.htm)

The Believers Position In Christ (http://members.tripod.com/jdlarsenmn/position.htm)

The Gift Of God (http://members.tripod.com/jdlarsenmn/gift.htm)

There are links to more info on this subject toward the bottom of the first article that I posted here.

[LaMontre]

I agree with LaMontre and the others, but I would add one thing. When someone appears to be saved, and then goes back to their old ways and says they no longer believe, chances are they never really believed in the first place. Lots of fakers out there. Sometimes it takes a while for things to sink into our hearts. Or sometimes we profess to believe in order to get a material or emotional need met, and it's not a genuine love of god. SO, to me, it's more like ORSAS, Once REALLY Saved Always Saved.

Good point.

1Ti 5:24 Some men's sins are open beforehand, going before to judgment; and some men they follow after.
1Ti 5:25 Likewise also the good works of some are manifest beforehand; and they that are otherwise cannot be hid.

[KitsapGirl]

Yes OSAS to a point. God will not cast out someone who clings to Him...Those who turn their backs on Him he will blot them out from the book...
Exodus 32:25 Now when Moses saw that the people were unrestrained (for Aaron had not restrained them, to their shame among their enemies), 26 then Moses stood in the entrance of the camp, and said, “Whoever is on the LORD’s side—come to me!” And all the sons of Levi gathered themselves together to him. 27 And he said to them, “Thus says the LORD God of Israel: ‘Let every man put his sword on his side, and go in and out from entrance to entrance throughout the camp, and let every man kill his brother, every man his companion, and every man his neighbor.’” 28 So the sons of Levi did according to the word of Moses. And about three thousand men of the people fell that day. 29 Then Moses said, “Consecrate yourselves today to the LORD, that He may bestow on you a blessing this day, for every man has opposed his son and his brother.” 30 Now it came to pass on the next day that Moses said to the people, “You have committed a great sin. So now I will go up to the LORD; perhaps I can make atonement for your sin.” 31 Then Moses returned to the LORD and said, “Oh, these people have committed a great sin, and have made for themselves a god of gold! 32 Yet now, if You will forgive their sin—but if not, I pray, blot me out of Your book which You have written.” 33 And the LORD said to Moses, “Whoever has sinned against Me, I will blot him out of My book. 34 Now therefore, go, lead the people to the place of which I have spoken to you. Behold, My Angel shall go before you. Nevertheless, in the day when I visit for punishment, I will visit punishment upon them for their sin.” 35 So the LORD plagued the people because of what they did with the calf which Aaron made.

The verse says sinned...in reality they CHOSE to not follow God. If one is born again, and then turns from God this is their choice...so no they are not "saved" because they CHOSE to leave God.

[adam423]

Yes OSAS to a point. God will not cast out someone who clings to Him...Those who turn their backs on Him he will blot them out from the book...

The verse says sinned...in reality they CHOSE to not follow God. If one is born again, and then turns from God this is their choice...so no they are not "saved" because they CHOSE to leave God.

Then you don't believe in OSAS.

There is a thread here somewhere, where I specifically asked all these questions and after reading all the posts and scriptures believe that my daughter will be in heaven with me some day.

Here is the link to this thread:

http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=10483

[KitsapGirl]

Then you don't believe in OSAS.

There is a thread here somewhere, where I specifically asked all these questions and after reading all the posts and scriptures believe that my daughter will be in heaven with me some day.

Here is the link to this thread:

http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=10483


In those terms no I do not believe in OSAS...I never said you could LOSE your salvation though...

People can & do CHOOSE to leave...In this they reject their salvation.

[KitsapGirl]

Once Saved Always Saved has the implication that

a) if you ask Jesus into your heart

+b) get baptised

+c) become indwelt with the HS

= you cannot go to hell.

I don't believe this to be wholly true.

What about those who do a, b, & c...then for one reason or another rejects God afterward? Were they never saved in the first place? Or do they still have their names written in the book of life?

I don't mean that if one does a, b, & c then commits sin they will be blotted out of the book...This is not a thing one does in rejection of Jesus. Jesus is a forgiving God. He will forgive, and not cast someone away for a sin or sins commited after salvation...