Purgatory? "outer darkness"? Heaven or Hell ?

[Buzzardhut]

Hey Buzzardhut. I just wanted to clarify that Chuck Missler isn't calling it purgatory as I understand the meaning of purgatory. He basically is stating (and I can't quote him right now), but if I remember when I heard his MP3 , he was saying something about certain christians might be closer to God than others depending on their rewards or lack thereof earned in this life (and yes, I agree that We don't earn anything, but the Holy Spirit through us. It's very confusing to me because he isn't calling it purgatory. When I get a chance, if you guys are OK with it, I'll post what he says and hopefully we can refute it point by point. I appreciate you guys because you certainly keep me on the right track. However, I don't want to misquote Chuck Missler or anything, so I would feel more comfortable posting some of his own words. Sometimes I don't get across the message. I've been wondering about this for a while, so would you mind if I posted it when I get a chance, or is it like beating a dead horse? His teaching on it is kinda confusing to me and possibly others. I hope he isn't right , but it wasn't purgatory that he was talking about.

I've already read what Missler wrote and there is no such thing as a Protestant Purgatory, the imaginary place is only for those who cannot comprehend God's grace and full forgiveness.

[acceptedintheBeloved]

Hey Buzzardhut. I just wanted to clarify that Chuck Missler isn't calling it purgatory as I understand the meaning of purgatory. He basically is stating (and I can't quote him right now), but if I remember when I heard his MP3 , he was saying something about certain christians might be closer to God than others depending on their rewards or lack thereof earned in this life (and yes, I agree that We don't earn anything, but the Holy Spirit through us. It's very confusing to me because he isn't calling it purgatory. When I get a chance, if you guys are OK with it, I'll post what he says and hopefully we can refute it point by point. I appreciate you guys because you certainly keep me on the right track. However, I don't want to misquote Chuck Missler or anything, so I would feel more comfortable posting some of his own words. Sometimes I don't get across the message. I've been wondering about this for a while, so would you mind if I posted it when I get a chance, or is it like beating a dead horse? His teaching on it is kinda confusing to me and possibly others. I hope he isn't right , but it wasn't purgatory that he was talking about.

He draws very heavily from "Israel's earthly, Millennial Kingdom" truths and blends them together with the "Church's heavenly" truths, blurring them all together without proper distinction, and the results are this idea of a place of "outer darkness in heaven" and "weeping and gnashing of teeth" for potentially any member of the Church, etc, (which is not a new idea, but still false). I mentioned some of these, I think, earlier in this thread.

When Israel and the Church are not kept distinct, in scripture (as should be done), a great many false teachings result. This is just one among many. :sad

[Peace777]

He draws very heavily from "Israel's earthly, Millennial Kingdom" truths and blends them together with the "Church's heavenly" truths, blurring them all together without proper distinction, and the results are this idea of a place of "outer darkness in heaven" and "weeping and gnashing of teeth" for potentially any member of the Church, etc, (which is not a new idea, but still false). I mentioned some of these, I think, earlier in this thread.

When Israel and the Church are not kept distinct, in scripture (as should be done), a great many false teachings result. This is just one among many. :sad


I've already read what Missler wrote and there is no such thing as a Protestant Purgatory, the imaginary place is only for those who cannot comprehend God's grace and full forgiveness.


Awesome! Thank you so much for this information. I totally agree with you guys/gals so I'm not going to waste my time doing research on this. You guys are right that we shouldn't follow any "man", but trust in God's Word. So, I'll keep reading the Word and not worry so much about other "books". Thank your for the responses.:hat

[OnTheHorizon]

Peace777, with all due respect to all posters here, you should always research for yourself. Nothing wrong with that at all.

[IMSAVED]

Well Missler is wrong about purgatory, it's a false teaching, Missler and Stanley should be ashamed of themselves :nono

I do not think that Dr.Charles Stanley is calling this "Purgatory" which the Catholics believe in. From studying what he has said it sounds like he is talking about where we have been with God when we die.I have heard that their is going to be degrees of rewards in Heaven and some will not receive rewards at all and will barely make it to Heaven.

[Buzzardhut]

I do not think that Dr.Charles Stanley is calling this "Purgatory" which the Catholics believe in. From studying what he has said it sounds like he is talking about where we have been with God when we die.I have heard that their is going to be degrees of rewards in Heaven and some will not receive rewards at all and will barely make it to Heaven.
Stanley and Missler impose a picture of a place of torment, which catholics do, including grief from loss of rewards, the believer will not grieve at the Bema or after the Bema or be in any place of darkness or torment, this is the new Protestant Purgatory which is a false teaching. Barely making it to heaven will still be paradise,

I'll personally be happy as just a gate polisher in heaven as long as it's the pearly gates of heaven and not the gates of hell.

Theses ideas and suggestions from paperbacks today are what become the doctrines of tomorrow.

[IMSAVED]

Stanley and Missler impose a picture of a place of torment, which catholics do, including grief from loss of rewards, the believer will not grieve at the Bema or after the Bema or be in any place of darkness or torment, this is the new Protestant Purgatory which is a false teaching. Barely making it to heaven will still be paradise,

I'll personally be happy as just a gate polisher in heaven as long as it's the pearly gates of heaven and not the gates of hell.

Theses ideas and suggestions from paperbacks today are what become the doctrines of tomorrow.

What do you think will happen to those who have not rewards and are barely getting into Heaven?

[Buzzardhut]

What do you think will happen to those who have not rewards and are barely getting into Heaven?

They go to heaven, God does not base our salvation on what we do after salvation, I'm in the OSAS camp. The Father will reward us on anything we do in the spirit after salvation, it will be a tremendous list, what we pray about, what we say to others, what we do for others, etc... The loss of rewards are acts we did not initiate when prompted by the Holy Spirit, for example; God might tell you "Go witness to that person" and you never do it, that would be a loss of reward for not sharing salvation with another, some theologians believe God will only bring up the directions of the Holy Spirit we acted upon, many pastors make it out to be a scolding event to motivate church members to do more church work, it can be a fear motivator, a guilt trip. I don't see our God of Grace this way, our God is a God of judgment for those who are not under the cross.

[Hootmon]

What do you think will happen to those who have not rewards and are barely getting into Heaven?Its a mistake to equate 'loss of reward' with 'loss of merit'. We never had any merit to begin with.

You either 'make it into Heaven' or you dont. There is no 'barely'.

[Kliska]

Having our bad works burned up IS a reward...one I look forward to.