Big Bubba - The Holidays Threads Merged

[Traveling Through]

I agree. And all ceremonial/Sabbath/Feasts/Dietary laws were abolished in Christ. Eph. 2:11-18.

I think this topic may cause some division. Watch out! :fear :lol2

Hopefully, it won't be division, but a healthy exchange of views that results from this thread.

[Teotwawki]

BIBLE MEDITATION:Exodus 20:8 - “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.”

DEVOTIONAL THOUGHT:

Is it okay to watch television on Sunday? Is it okay to go to a ball game on Sunday? Is it okay to eat out on Sunday? Is it okay to read the newspaper on Sunday? Can I play softball on Sunday? Can I go out on a boat on Sunday? Can I go to the grocery store if we’re out of milk on Sunday? Good questions. I hear them all the time, but do you know what’s wrong with these questions? You’re asking the wrong man. It’s not my day — it’s the Lord’s day. Ask Him.

ACTION POINT:

Ask God, “How can I honor You on the Lord’s Day so that at the end of the day I can know that it was indeed Your day?”

Sunday isn't the Sabbath.

[RVIDES]

Hey everyone im not sure if this is the right place to post this but here goes... i’m new on these boards and i have a question that i asked on another thread but got no answers so i guess ill make this my first thread that i have created here.

First off i want to say that I believe in Jesus and that he is the son of God and i can’t even begin to describe the gratitude i have for my Lord for dieing on the cross for my sins. Having said that what does christmas have to do with him? And this is a serious question.

As far as i know and please correct me if i’m wrong but the bible does not state when Jesus was born, and in Jeremiah 10:3-5 it states, "For the customs of the people are vain: for it is but a tree which one cutteth out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman with the axe. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not, ... neither ... is it in them to do good." I mean doesn’t the lord tell us to not involve ourselves with the customs and traditions of this world that are pagan, false or idolotrous?

I always wonder and ask my self that if Jesus wanted us to know and celebrate his birthday on december 25 and to put up a tree and send each other gifts, he would have told us, i mean he is God and he is perfect, its not like after the bible was created our lord just said “oh i forgot to tell everyone that i was born on the 25 of december and that they should celebrate that day for me”. I mean when you really think about it, we chose the 25th of december as the day we give each other gifts and blindly without any evidence stamped Jesus birthday on it, and you have to ask yourself how is giving each other gifts celebrating Jesus or his brith if anything we should be giving him gifts, i find that really messed up.

I hope i didnt offend anyone and thats not my purpose i just want to find the truth about this day after all if this holiday is pagan and many christians celebrate it, doesn’t that effect your salvation since you are unknowingly celebrating something that is not of God, and how can u stand up to God and say “im sorry i didnt know” when it is up to all of us to read and find out what the truth is. Like the lord says in the end we are all without excuse but If some one can help me understand this i would greatly appreciate it.

[Steve53]

The ancient (BC) origins of the celebration are indeed pagan in nature.

Celebrating Christmas will not effect one's salvation in the least.

[soon and very soon]

chuck smith just did an indepth look at the origins etc... on hischannel under "video on demand".
http://www.hischannel.com/streambird/1000th/1000th/vodtv.html

[jackson64]

the day doesn't matter..and we aren't celebrating anything pagan..it is simply a day that is set aside to celebrate the wonderful gift of God to us, our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. The early church could have set aside any date on the calendar and the reason would not be diminished. I believe that gift giving is just in the heartfelt feeling of the celebration--the magi from the east gave gifts to the baby Jesus (probably about 6 months old when they got there). Christ himself was a precious gift to us..so the giving of gifts is done with this in our hearts..

There is no significance in the date...and even if it fell on Halloween it wouldn't affect salvation..ancient pagan festivals have no bearing on why I celebrate the birth of my Saviour...

other interesting facts:
no stable is mentioned ( was likely a cave)
no donkey is mentioned ( probably had a cart)
no mention of "wisemen or kings", they were called magi
the magi did not arrive the night of Jesus birth--but months later

there are even more, but I can't recall off the top of my head..

[Christina]

If I'm not mistaken, Christians decided to celebrate this time as the birth of Christ as a way to "offset" the worship of the winter solstice. They tried to take away from the pagan holiday, a way to "distract" people away from paganism and towards the birth of Christ, our Lord and Savior.

The date of December 25th originated with the ancient "birthday" of the son-god, Mithra, a pagan deity whose religious influence became widespread in the Roman Empire during the first few centuries A.D. Mithra was related to the Semitic sun-god, Shamash, and his worship spread throughout Asia to Europe where he was called Deus Sol Invictus Mithras. As such, Rome converted this pagan legacy to a celebration of the god, Saturn, and the rebirth of the sun god during the winter solstice period. The winter holiday became known as Saturnalia and began the week prior to December 25th. In return, later, Christians chose to celebrate the birth of Christ instead, to try to "counter-act" the pagan worship.

[RVIDES]

Interesting, but doesn’t anyone stop and think that doing this may anger God, i mean the lord did give us instructions of how we are to commemorate his death Corinthians 11:23-26, but yet he doesn’t even mention a single word about if we should celebrate his birth, now don’t get me wrong Jesus coming to the world is the best thing that ever happen to this planet but if Jesus wanted us to celebrate he would have told us.

Maybe the reason the Jesus never told us to celebrate his birthday is because he knew that the people of the world would in the end accept the old pagan origins of this holiday with out even knowing the true significance, but thats just speculation and isn’t this one of our responisbilites as christians, to find out if what we are doing is right and if it isnt shouldnt we say or do something about it? I guess the real question probably is Should we continue to refer as december 25 the day Jesus was born fully knowing that there isnt any evidence to support such a claim? and if we know that he wasn’t born anytime around this date why do we continue to celebrate a lie?

If it was decided by christians to celebrate this time as the birth of Christ as a way to "offset” any other pagan and false worshipping holidays my only question to that would be why? Our job is to tell the world not to indulge themselves in such practices and not to counter attack there false customs with another because by christians telling the world the Jesus was born on this supposed day without having the evidence aren’t we just lieing to the people, i mean if ur going to say something we better be sure about what we are talking about other wise we lose credibility with the people of this world and then you’ll get people saying why should we follow you and your bible if you christians don’t even follow it yourselves.

[Obadiah]

For an interesting alternative to the "December 25 was just a pagan thing," check out:

http://www.bib-arch.org/e-features/christmas.asp

As for Jeremiah 10... it's talking about idolatry, not about decorating trees.

[RVIDES]

Obadiah, very interesting but despite all that is written in the article the author himself does admit that we cannot truly know for sure whether doing this is right or wrong. So when you get an answer like that, i mean what do you do with that, in one hand you have him giving references as to why it might be good to celebrate christmas but at the same time you have him saying that the whole thing is pagan and we all know that paganism is wrong.

As for Jeremiah 10 your right, it is talking about idolatry, but the key is to look at the practices that they are doing that make the whole thing idolatrous I mean verses 3-5 are very clear what would u call someone who cuts a tree and fastens it with nails so that it won’t move and then decks it with silver and gold? The lords very clear on what he calls it and that’s the whole point.