Big Bubba - The Holidays Threads Merged

[Sassy Granny]

Quote:
Isa 28:17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place.

I believe Isa 28:17 has a future and far reaching fulfilment, and it's coming soon to a location near you (and me).

Lavender, I don't believe you've let anyone down. You're taking responsibility for your own doctrine. But I must say the referenced quote (Is 28:17) comes off as a curse; as though you're indicting opposing views with it. I'm not sure you intended it that way, but that's how it plays.

The scriptures encourage us to reason together. That's a good thing - whether it be about Sabbath-keeping or other doctrinal items. We each need to know and and be fully convinced of our convictions. Thus I have no trouble freeing you to believe as you do. It just feels like you want the subject to be black/white, win/lose, right/wrong.

Bottom line is that sabbath-keeping, even if it were in effect today, was a mandate for Israel and not for the church. And, as I've said and as others have said, if you're going to keep the Law, you need to keep the whole Law.

Thus I close my own comments on this particular forum. No doubt we'll meet up again on another topic. :wave

In the meantime, God bless you richly. May we all bring glory and honor to Him.

Kathleen

[lisaann]

1 Cor 10:20 20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.

This verse is pertaining to idol worship. As you can see idols = devils.

[Tio-Peregrino]

1 Cor 10:20 20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.

This verse is pertaining to idol worship. As you can see idols = devils.

What post are you answering or referencing here???:idunno

[Tio-Peregrino]

Quote:
Isa 28:17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place.

Quote from Tio:
What's your point? I think this is the third time I've asked...


Sorry Tio for failing to address your question. I believe Isa 28:17 has a future and far reaching fulfilment, and it's coming soon to a location near you (and me).


14 Therefore hear the word of the LORD, you scornful men,
Who rule this people who are in Jerusalem,
15 Because you have said, “We have made a covenant with death,
And with Sheol we are in agreement.
When the overflowing scourge passes through,
It will not come to us,
For we have made lies our refuge,
And under falsehood we have hidden ourselves.”

16 Therefore thus says the Lord GOD:

“ Behold, I lay in Zion a stone for a foundation,
A tried stone, a precious cornerstone, a sure foundation;
Whoever believes will not act hastily.
17 Also I will make justice the measuring line,
And righteousness the plummet;
The hail will sweep away the refuge of lies,
And the waters will overflow the hiding place.
18 Your covenant with death will be annulled,
And your agreement with Sheol will not stand;
When the overflowing scourge passes through,
Then you will be trampled down by it.
19 As often as it goes out it will take you;
For morning by morning it will pass over,
And by day and by night;
It will be a terror just to understand the report.”
20 For the bed is too short to stretch out on,
And the covering so narrow that one cannot wrap himself in it.
21 For the LORD will rise up as at Mount Perazim,
He will be angry as in the Valley of Gibeon—
That He may do His work, His awesome work,
And bring to pass His act, His unusual act.
22 Now therefore, do not be mockers,
Lest your bonds be made strong;
For I have heard from the Lord GOD of hosts,
A destruction determined even upon the whole earth.



It pertains to Jerusalem...look at Isaiah 28:14. It also deals with Northern Israel or Ephraim or the area of Samaria. As far as the Scripture delineates I don't see that it pertains to Southern California specifically. Yes, it has future application as we read about the Day of the Lord...His unusual act...His awesome work...His act (all phrases that point to The Day of the Lord). There is a "covenant of death" mentioned in Isiaiah 28:18, which appears to be the same covenant referred to in Daniel 9:27...


27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolate.”


Also, I'm sorry for being such a poor communicator, from my point of view, I have let you and the others here down.

I don't think you're a poor communicator. We're still having a discussion, no?

[Tio-Peregrino]

No. The question was settled once and for all at the Council in Jerusalem. It was put up for consideration by some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees. They said "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses." The apostles and elders met to consider this question, and then Peter said:

"Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are." Then the whole council formed a letter meant to be read by us. It said: "It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things. Farewell."

And then the matter was settled forever.

:amen

[Tio-Peregrino]

Today is August 25th. Christmas is in four months. Also my birthday and my youngest daughter's birthday. While we don't celebrate as the world dictates, we do enjoy the festivities. We know that Jesus wasn't born on that day, but we kind of feel the specialness of sharing that day with Him. If we cannot celebrate with joy the God of the universe and His Son, our Saviour, then we are a sad lot.

Exactly. We are the same. I grew up celebrating Christmas, and have never associated it with anything but a celebration of Jesus's coming to earth as a man...a celebration of the virgin birth...a celebration of how the Magi knew, and had been waiting and watching for His arrival.

[Anddra]

Exactly. We are the same. I grew up celebrating Christmas, and have never associated it with anything but a celebration of Jesus's coming to earth as a man...a celebration of the virgin birth...a celebration of how the Magi knew, and had been waiting and watching for His arrival.

I think many of us had that same experience, Tio. Christmas to us was and is about Jesus.

[PickensSlim]

No. The question was settled once and for all at the Council in Jerusalem. It was put up for consideration by some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees. They said "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses." The apostles and elders met to consider this question, and then Peter said: "Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are." Then the whole council formed a letter meant to be read by us. It said: "It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things. Farewell." And then the matter was settled forever.

The question that I was asking was "Did Jewish Law EVER (before the advent) apply to gentiles for their salvation" I would argue no. The Chinese emperor used to sacrifice an ox annually to the creator G-d to cover the sins of his people. What about Greeks that came to Jerusalem to offer a sacrifice in faith , but weren't prosletytes?

The covenent was that if the Jews lived by the law then G-d would give them a SPECIAL blessing and if they didn't they they suffered the consequences. The special blessing was to make Jehova attractive to the fallen nations.

Slim

[HeIsEnough]

Well ok, sorry I misunderstood you.

[lavender]

Lavender, I don't believe you've let anyone down. You're taking responsibility for your own doctrine. But I must say the referenced quote (Is 28:17) comes off as a curse; as though you're indicting opposing views with it. I'm not sure you intended it that way, but that's how it plays.

The scriptures encourage us to reason together. That's a good thing - whether it be about Sabbath-keeping or other doctrinal items. We each need to know and and be fully convinced of our convictions. Thus I have no trouble freeing you to believe as you do. It just feels like you want the subject to be black/white, win/lose, right/wrong.

Bottom line is that sabbath-keeping, even if it were in effect today, was a mandate for Israel and not for the church. And, as I've said and as others have said, if you're going to keep the Law, you need to keep the whole Law.

Thus I close my own comments on this particular forum. No doubt we'll meet up again on another topic. :wave

In the meantime, God bless you richly. May we all bring glory and honor to Him.

Kathleen


Hey Sassy, because I've been on both sides of the issues we have talked about, I understand where you are coming from and your concerns. I appreciate your patience and kind words and will probably talk with you later.

Blessings