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messenger
November 9th, 2007, 07:12 AM
An interesting Greek word study

Matthew 5:17,18: (17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill (Greek: playroo).
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled (Greek: ginomai)).
Let’s look at the Greek word ginomai in verse 18 translated in the KJV as “fulfilled” and consider this explaination of these two greek words both translated in the KJV by the English word “fulfilled”. In verse 17 Jesus fulfilled the whole law of God on behalf of fallen mankind. In verse 18, not one jot nor tittle shall pass from the law (the law that Jesus fulfilled in the previous verse) until all be fulfilled. Two different Greek words translated by the the King James by the same English word. Our focus here will be on the word ginomai in verse 18.

“γινωμαι” (ginomai) The word "fulfilled" here in this context means: as in Acts 12:11 (when Peter realized that his experience in being delivered from jail by the angel was real), "to come to ones self; to have recovered one's senses or understanding" here it is in the context of recovering one's senses in regard to the finished work in vs.17 in regard to Christ having fulfilled the law. The word in vs. Matt. 5:17 translated as "fulfill", is "πληροω" which means "to fill up or complete" and Jesus did just that; He fulfilled the whole law on our behalf. In Matt. 5:18 however, the word translated "fulfilled" is this Greek word (ginomai) which means in its context, that the law will not pass by someone who has not come to his senses about the fact that the law has been fulfilled already on his behalf; that Jesus fulfilled it on his behalf once for all in Hebrews 10:10 , and Hebrews 10:14. The reasoning is that God’s law must be fulfilled, and if Christ has not completely done it,(but remember, He has), then it is incumbent upon me to do it but I can't do it due to my inability in my fallen Adamic nature. So in vss 25,26 Agree with thine adversary quickly...(thine adversary being the Holy Spirit Who is the adversary of my sinful being which desires to usurp Jesus’ place as the fulfiller of the law) until thou must pay the utmost farthing which means in itself that you will be brought to the end of yourself the hard way until finally you look to Christ with the sacrifices of praise and thanksgiving for all He has done.

So what’s the lesson here? Just simply believe the finished work of Christ that He fulfilled the Law of God on behalf of me a sinner, and because He came to represent me before the Father, the Father is satisfied by the perfect life of His Son on my behalf. There are no amount of good works performed by me that can add to what Jesus my savior has done. I am saved by grace through faith and that not of myself, it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast (Eph. 2:8,9).

HeIsEnough
November 9th, 2007, 08:07 AM
So what’s the lesson here? Just simply believe the finished work of Christ that He fulfilled the Law of God on behalf of me a sinner

And sometimes....it takes 'trying' to fulfill the law under our own power to be fully persuaded that we cannot do what He has already done. All studies invariably point back to the central truth of Christ on the cross. :thumb

messenger
November 9th, 2007, 09:53 AM
'It is finished!' Jn 19:30.

The Sower
November 12th, 2007, 03:46 AM
And sometimes....it takes 'trying' to fulfill the law under our own power to be fully persuaded that we cannot do what He has already done. All studies invariably point back to the central truth of Christ on the cross. :thumb

amen:thumb

Obadiah
November 23rd, 2007, 12:36 PM
Messenger:

Your "Greek word study" is indeed interesting -- but incorrect.

The verb ginomai does not mean 'come to one's senses.' You won't find this definition in any lexicon or dictionary I've ever consulted. The verse you cited for this proposed usage, Acts 12:11, does not support it. The verse reads: Petros, genomenos en heauto... The part about "to himself" is not in the verb ginomai; it's in the phrase en heauto. The verb ginomai here simply means 'come, become' as it normally does. There is absolutely no basis for proposing that the verb ginomai means 'come to oneself' or 'come to one's senses' or anything of the sort.

So your proposal that genetai in Matthew 5:18 refers to someone coming to his senses is invalid. Even if the verb could mean that -- which it can't -- the syntax wouldn't support your proposal, anyhow. The subject of genetai is panta (until all things come to pass). For your idea to have even a chance of being correct, you'd have to invent a new subject, completely unstated in the text, for genetai, and then figure out what to do grammatically with the now superfluous panta. There's no basis whatsoever for any of that, either.

Finally, your interpretation of the ensuing material is creative but does injustice to the text. The "adversary" is not the Holy Spirit (who is not our adversary but our Advocate), but the person with whom the subject is having a dispute, the "brother" who "has something against you" in v.23. Paying the last penny is not being "brought to the end of yourself the hard way" but, indeed, a portrayal of judgment.

So, what's the lesson here? A little dabble of Greek can be dangerous.

messenger
November 24th, 2007, 08:01 PM
Is what I said dangerous?
You're right, I'm not a Greek scholar and if what I said was dangerous or unscriptural please show me how and if so I'll repent.
I too believe that the Holy Spirit is my advocate, because He most certainly is. He is the adversary of my sinful flesh not my regenerated spirit.
I phrase for Matt. 5:18 "to come to oneself, to have recovered ones senses or understanding" for Acts 12:11 came from the Hebrew Greek study Bible edited by Spiros Zodihaiates on page 1700 under the definition for ginomai; Strongs number 1096.

Obadiah
November 24th, 2007, 11:16 PM
Messenger:

Wow! What a marvelously humble attitude. I'm so used to dealing with people on Christian forums who get totally defensive when I disagree with them. I'm truly blessed by your approach.

(Kind of a sad commentary that a Christian acting in a Christlike manner is such a novelty, but I guess we should leave that for another day.)

What's remarkable about your post is that your conclusion -- approaching God entirely on the merits of Christ -- isn't dangerous at all. It's actually quite correct and edifying. It's sort of like someone who takes a series of wrong turns but ends up at the proper destination. The work of the Holy Spirit in us is altogether lovely.

No, it's really just that I've seen so many examples of the misuse of the biblical languages -- "the Greek says this" or "the Hebrew says that" when, in fact, it says nothing of the kind -- perhaps I reacted a bit too strongly when I read this thread. Addressing the use of biblical languages is a strong interest of mine.

Not sure what's up with Zodhiates on Acts 12:11. Perhaps he was referring to the entire expression rather than to the verb itself and just didn't make this sufficiently clear in his exposition. Don't have access to Strong's, either, so I can't comment on that.

I'm sorry if the expression of my thoughts was in any way hurtful.

messenger
November 25th, 2007, 12:27 PM
Obadiah,

Wow back to ya! Thanks for constructive / edifying words of encouragement / instruction my brother.
Not hurtful at all.