PDA

View Full Version : Help!


Compatriot G
April 2nd, 2008, 10:38 AM
I'm not sure if this is the right section for this, but it seems to fall in this category. Basically, I'm having trouble understanding an individuals beliefs. I interact with this person on another message board. He has stated that he is a confirmed "Elohist". From what I have been able to find, this revolves around some debate about the author of the Pentateuch. While I personally believe it was Moses, there is a school of thought that says the Pentateuch was written by two unknown authors. They refer to them as "E" and "J". "E" stands for "El" or "Elohim" and "J" stands for "Yahweh" or "Jehovah". The "E"'s seem to believe that Elohim is the true God and that Yahweh is a false god. This individual has mentioned that the Old Testament has been corrupted by the "J"'s. He also says the New Testament has been corrupted by Hellenistic Jews. He says that Judah is not Israel, only the ten northern tribes are true Israel. He constantly refers to Jesus as "the man commonly called Jesus". Yet, he does seem to believe in the Holy Ghost. He seems to believe that God is a god of peace and would never be vengeful or tell Israel to destroy the inhabitants of the land. He stated he was studying for the ministry, then quit when he "discovered" the entire Bible is basically a fraud. I have never heard of this particular belief before and was wondering if anybody else had any info on this subject.
Mods, if you need to move this to another section, please feel free. It seems like it could go in more than one section.

Wildcat81
April 2nd, 2008, 01:42 PM
That's... wow. That's kind of wacky.

As far as the J and E stuff, that's part of what's called the "Documentary Hypothesis," usually known by the acronym JEDP. The argument goes that the Pentateuch was compiled from four different source documents: the Yahwist (or "Jahwist," in German, which is where the theory comes from originally - 19th century German scholars), Elohist, Deuteronomist, and the Priestly author/document.

This person you're talking to seems to have gone in a very different direction with the documentary hypothesis than is usually done. I've heard of people who go to seminary or to get a theological education and wind up unable to handle some of the issues that arise (in fact, a roll call of liberal scholarship among both NT and OT scholars would yield a significant number of such people). But I've never before heard of someone calling themselves an Elohist, as opposed to a Yahwist, as a label for a theological position. That's... well, it's kinda weird.

As for the bit about only the ten tribes being "Israel," he's almost right, in that the Northern Kingdom kept the name "Israel" when the kingdoms divided after Solomon's death. Now, some OT scholars will argue that pretty much anything prior to the divided kingdom is a myth. If that were so, then it would be correct to say that only the North was really Israel.

I'd be interested to know where this person went to "prepare for ministry." I'm assuming it was some sort of Seminary? Do you know where? Which seminary, which denomination? Frankly it sounds to me like he's misunderstood a fair bit of what he was taught, and what he did understand, he handled badly.