Pauline Dispensationalism

[Mechaberean]

There is ONE baptism now and its not water.One faith now,not many like in the Old Testament.Hebrews11(faiths)

[LaMontre]

Dabbling in early Jewish church doctrine again ?(1 Peter 1:5 ).."Who are KEPT by the power of God through faith unto salvation.." that's funny,I don't see the word grace .Whose argument has fallen flat ? As I mentioned ; Baptism + Jews= requirement ;(Acts 2:38) Baptizm + Gentiles= ordinance(Rom.6:3-7) And I never said they "weren't being baptized" just that it's not necessary.Time to re-boot , your files corrupted. :preach

Your refusal to admit that your wrong simply makes your doctrine less believable (if thats possible).

What do you think grace is but the power of God to keep us through faith??

I hate to prove you wrong again.

1Pe 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

1Pe 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

1Pe 4:10 As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.

1Pe 5:12 By Silvanus, a faithful brother unto you, as I suppose, I have written briefly, exhorting, and testifying that this is the true grace of God wherein ye stand.

2Pe 1:2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
2Pe 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Sheesh, what more do we need to show you completely wrong?

[Topped 3]

Your refusal to admit that your wrong simply makes your doctrine less believable (if thats possible).

What do you think grace is but the power of God to keep us through faith??

I hate to prove you wrong again.

1Pe 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

1Pe 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

1Pe 4:10 As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.

1Pe 5:12 By Silvanus, a faithful brother unto you, as I suppose, I have written briefly, exhorting, and testifying that this is the true grace of God wherein ye stand.

2Pe 1:2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
2Pe 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Sheesh, what more do we need to show you completely wrong?
Nice try,but you overlook an Important element that Paul adds to the word faith talking to the gentiles that Peter doesn't mention here in these verses you posted in 2 Peter. Paul emphasizes "Grace Through faith"in his epistles,talking to both Jews and Gentiles in THIS "dispensation of the grace of God ". Peter's message is not the same as Pauls;Close! But Peter must take greater care in his epistles because he is potentially speaking to 3 different audiences.1.) Early acts Jews and Jewish proselytes saved by faith+repentance +baptism + works meet for repentance.2.)Jews saved by Grace through faith of Christ-in this dispensation of grace there's neither Jew nor Gentile-both saved the same.3.)Tribulation jews and gentiles back under the faith + repentance +baptism+works program again. And that is why he emphasizes the word grace in 2 Peter;With the emergence of Paul's Gospel , Peter's message had now become more complicated . You don't have ta git huffy. :twitch

[LaMontre]

Once again, all opinion with no biblical reasoning.

I do tend to get "huffy" at false doctrine. I am rather passionate about the simplicity that is in Christ Jesus. Which is glaringly lacking in your doctrine.

But you (and others like you) are obviously entitled to believe what you want to believe, and I am just happy to be here showing it all to be nothing more than conjecture and bad interpretation.

I will pray, but I think I have said as much as the Lord will allow at this point.

[Topped 3]

Nice try,but you overlook an Important element that Paul adds to the word faith talking to the gentiles that Peter doesn't mention here in these verses you posted in 2 Peter. Paul emphasizes "Grace Through faith"in his epistles,talking to both Jews and Gentiles in THIS "dispensation of the grace of God ". Peter's message is not the same as Pauls;Close! But Peter must take greater care in his epistles because he is potentially speaking to 3 different audiences.1.) Early acts Jews and Jewish proselytes saved by faith+repentance +baptism + works meet for repentance.2.)Jews saved by Grace through faith of Christ-in this dispensation of grace there's neither Jew nor Gentile-both saved the same.3.)Tribulation jews and gentiles back under the faith + repentance +baptism+works program again. And that is why he emphasizes the word grace in 2 Peter;With the emergence of Paul's Gospel , Peter's message had now become more complicated . You don't have ta git huffy. :twitch And in 1 Peter he starts out in v.1.."..to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus,Galatia,etc...He is evidently adressing Jews, Proselytes and the elect.. And by the subject Peter covers in some of these verses,we Know that he is referring to "WORKS'' "obedience" "commands to Love " 1 Pe.1:13 ; 1"17 ; 1:22. And in 1 Pe. 2:9 .."But you are a chosen generation,a royal priesthood,an holy NATION, a peculiar people.." Wow .with all this nation and generation and priesthood talk,and works and love and purity of heart and obedience : which Paul never tells the Gentiles that they have to perform to be saved or achieve grace; hmmm,you would almost think Peter is addressing JEWS and PROSELYTES here. :aha

[Mechaberean]

Oh so there was no garce before the cross of course there was or God would've wiped us out long ago.

[Mechaberean]

Genesis 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. No cross yet until what 4,000 years later.

[Mechaberean]

by the way it wasn't through faith for the circumsion it was by Hebrews 11 a whole chapter on it.Romans3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith. God made no mistakes in what He wrote He meant every word.

[HeIsEnough]

Wow .with all this nation and generation and priesthood talk,and works and love and purity of heart and obedience : which Paul never tells the Gentiles that they have to perform to be saved or achieve grace;

This will not stand up to scrutiny...here is Paul speaking...


Acts 13

16Standing up, Paul motioned with his hand and said: "Men of Israel and you Gentiles who worship God, listen to me! 17The God of the people of Israel chose our fathers; he made the people prosper during their stay in Egypt, with mighty power he led them out of that country, 18he endured their conduct[a] for about forty years in the desert, 19he overthrew seven nations in Canaan and gave their land to his people as their inheritance. 20All this took about 450 years.

"After this, God gave them judges until the time of Samuel the prophet. 21Then the people asked for a king, and he gave them Saul son of Kish, of the tribe of Benjamin, who ruled forty years. 22After removing Saul, he made David their king. He testified concerning him: 'I have found David son of Jesse a man after my own heart; he will do everything I want him to do.'

23"From this man's descendants God has brought to Israel the Savior Jesus, as he promised. 24Before the coming of Jesus, John preached repentance and baptism to all the people of Israel. 25As John was completing his work, he said: 'Who do you think I am? I am not that one. No, but he is coming after me, whose sandals I am not worthy to untie.'

26"Brothers, children of Abraham, and you God-fearing Gentiles, it is to us that this message of salvation has been sent. 27The people of Jerusalem and their rulers did not recognize Jesus, yet in condemning him they fulfilled the words of the prophets that are read every Sabbath. 28Though they found no proper ground for a death sentence, they asked Pilate to have him executed. 29When they had carried out all that was written about him, they took him down from the tree and laid him in a tomb. 30But God raised him from the dead, 31and for many days he was seen by those who had traveled with him from Galilee to Jerusalem. They are now his witnesses to our people.

32"We tell you the good news: What God promised our fathers 33he has fulfilled for us, their children, by raising up Jesus. As it is written in the second Psalm:
" 'You are my Son;
today I have become your Father.[b]'[c] 34The fact that God raised him from the dead, never to decay, is stated in these words:
" 'I will give you the holy and sure blessings promised to David.'[d] 35So it is stated elsewhere:
" 'You will not let your Holy One see decay.'[e]

There is just so much to cull from in how Paul related these things, here Paul is relating the inclusive nature of the message to all who believed in Him, Jew and Gentile, and rightly dividing it from what transpired on the cross. I don't see the need for the particulars of the Pauline view.

Perhaps that is a different take for you two, show the direct need for this view, with contrasting elements which you feel are missing. One Pauline adherent once told me that it "resolves certain problems", though he failed at disseminating exactly what they were. Maybe you two can...

[Topped 3]

by the way it wasn't through faith for the circumsion it was by Hebrews 11 a whole chapter on it.Romans3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith. God made no mistakes in what He wrote He meant every word. Gal 216.."Knowing that a man is NOT justified by the works of the Law, but by the faith OF Jesus Christ,even we have believed in Jesus Christ,that we might be justified by the FAITH OF Christ , and not by the works of the Law; for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.."(Early acts and trib.saints Justified by works of the Law ONLY if it is preceded and motivated BY FAITH , but no flesh is ever justified;corruption cannot inherit incorruption . Church age saints only justified by GRACE through FAITH of Christ . :scratch