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Thread: Speaking In Tongues?

  1. #681
    BLESSED BEYOND BELIEF Guest

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    May I say 'AMEN! to all that the moderators had to say on this thread. For years I have been in the minority when I would speak out about 'false doctrine'. No one wanted to hear it. I want to thank the Lord that I found this place to come to. I know He sent me here. (to bolster my backbone) He is so merciful. Blessings to all.

  2. #682
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    I watch him occasionally because he truly knows about the Jewish traditions and so much more when it comes to the history of Israel. Many of his shows are taped from the Holy Land...that's when I especially watch. However, I do not take everything he says hook, line and sinker. We must, as stated, use discernment. I'm not "throwing the baby out with the bathwater"....I weed out that which does not follow the bible. However, for a new believer all this could be confusing....wherein lies the rub. Finding the truth is not a smorgasboard (sp), we can't pick and choose what we want to believe...however when it comes to Jewish customs and traditions...I think Perry Stone is one of the most learned around. (jmho)
    "Even so, come Lord Jesus, come. Even so....come and take Your Bride away. How my soul longs to be with You, my Lord! Even so, even so, come, Lord Jesus, come!" (Rev. 22:20)...Terry MacAlmon Music Ministries

  3. #683
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biblenuggetlady View Post

    It is very easy to get caught up in an intoxicating spiral of searching for "hidden knowledge" only revealed to a few.



    There were too many extra Biblical revelations and exaggerations being made by many prophecy teachers today and it has become as addictive as drugs to many. They need more and more hidden knowledge and revelation and jump on every message that is made without using discernment and the Word to verify.
    There have been many great posts here, but this is what I want to emphasize - excellent. It should always raise our red flags of discernment when one teacher claims that they have hidden knowledge, when they claim they have special revelations that the rest of the Body does not have. The Bible is not about hidden knowledge for a select few.

    I used to watch Perry Stone too. He does have nice backdrops of scenes of Israel on some of his shows.

    But what does he say that we need to know that is not taught by other Christian teachers? Ones that don't have his doctrinal and other questionable baggage, such as paying high prices for his secrets?

    If he is sought out for his teachings on Jewish backgrounds of our beliefs, there is a wealth of information taught by so many others which can be resourced on this site. Perry Stone doesn't have anything that God has withheld from the Body. That's one danger of his claims. Please be careful.

  4. #684
    lynlyn Guest

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    Thank you all for your posts.I do understand that perry goes off on strange things about his dad and these dreams he has but I do think his heart is in the right place,I am sure he loves the lord and seems humble to me.I do like his teachings about Israel.But I wont take everything he says hook line and sinker.I also uderstand the point of veiw that you cannot schedule an interview with every teacher and ask them why they teach such things.so actually this has been a good learning experiance for me.GOD BLESS you all.I am amazed at how well read on the bible some of you are.I have been studying 4 years and have a long way to go.A lifetime!

  5. #685
    Berean Girl Guest

    Default I need an answer - seriously

    Why is it that some on this board continue to follow a teacher who is known known known to be fellowshipping with either wofs, heretics, or the like and still think they have something to offer that is worth their while???????

    Very bad discernment here and I would even go so far as to say tickling ears syndrome.

    For those of you who keep using the excuse that he has good teachings on prophecy and all things jewish, you are without excuse.

    They are way better ministries out there who are DOCTRINALLY SOUND such as Zola Levitt, Arnold Fruchtenbaum and others.

  6. #686
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Agreed. I'm appalled that some on here are appalled when we follow the Word and hold teachers to the light.
    It's pride, brother. We are to die to ourselves every day, as we all know. It's hard to kill that old foe pride. It's hard to hear that someone you think is "right" or "good" may not be as pure as you had hoped. Money is a mammoth corrupter. I have no doubts that many of these WOF'ers and others started in the ministry with good intentions and did it for the so-called "right" reasons. But as they grew, they succumb at various levels to the fame and fortune of it all.

    Then it's a matter of convincing yourself that this is "what God wants" for you. Many of them get to that point. It's one of the greatest deceptions in the Church today, unfortunately, and now it feeds upon itself in a never-ending cycle of people parading to the podium, telling you it's a curse to be poor and that "God wants His Children to be rich". That "doctrine" exists solely to soothe their own troubled spirits, which are humming away that it's wrong, that they are warping the Words of the Living God.

    Religion trumps relationship again, I'm afraid.

    Let me be blunt -- if God won't do anything for me until I give someone else dollar bills, I will not serve that God. How very petty from the supposed Creator of the Universe! Jesus died on the cross so that people could accumulate worldly possessions!?! I think not.

    Fortunately, the True God loves us so much that He became one of us and sacrificed Himself so that we could be made righteous through His Shed Blood! Amen!

    I used to really like Perry Stone myself as well, but when he hangs out with Benny Hinn and Paula White, well, I love God a whole lot more than I love my own foolish pride. Some of what he says is good and true, but some of it is foul and false. Period.

    So I moved on. I only want the Truth, and as Christians, that should be what we all strive to keep. The Truth in Christ Jesus and Him Crucified.

    God bless and keep you all.

    Maranatha!

  7. #687
    Final Trumpet Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Berean Girl View Post
    Why is it that some on this board continue to follow a teacher who is known known known to be fellowshipping with either wofs, heretics, or the like and still think they have something to offer that is worth their while???????

    Very bad discernment here and I would even go so far as to say tickling ears syndrome.

    For those of you who keep using the excuse that he has good teachings on prophecy and all things jewish, you are without excuse.

    They are way better ministries out there who are DOCTRINALLY SOUND such as Zola Levitt, Arnold Fruchtenbaum and others.

    Sadly, I think that is why John Hagee still has such a huge following. After I got saved back in the mid 90's I loved listening to Hagee. He had that "hellfire and brimstone" style that I liked and good knowledge. Well, after a short while my eyes were opened to him as he kept preaching sermons about something and then had a product to sell related to that sermon at the end. One that comes to mind is the prayer shawl. He preached about it then at the end you could buy your own from him. So are his sermons led by the Holy Spirit or led by a marketing campaign. They were like infomercials. Then I saw him taking the stage with Benny Hinn and kept away after that.

    People get attached to a teacher and then will not hear a word against them even though the proof is there.

  8. #688
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    Quote Originally Posted by Final Trumpet View Post
    Sadly, I think that is why John Hagee still has such a huge following. After I got saved back in the mid 90's I loved listening to Hagee. He had that "hellfire and brimstone" style that I liked and good knowledge. Well, after a short while my eyes were opened to him as he kept preaching sermons about something and then had a product to sell related to that sermon at the end. One that comes to mind is the prayer shawl. He preached about it then at the end you could buy your own from him. So are his sermons led by the Holy Spirit or led by a marketing campaign. They were like infomercials. Then I saw him taking the stage with Benny Hinn and kept away after that.

    People get attached to a teacher and then will not hear a word against them even though the proof is there.
    Agreed. I have quit listening to Hagee myself, and in the mid-90s I listened to him every chance I got. Even donated to him ministry a time or two. Something has happened regarding him that is troubling to my spirit. I have real trouble with these preachers supposedly getting a word from the Holy Spirit then selling something afterwards or in relation to it. If it's so true and important, how could you demand money for it??

    God bless.

  9. #689
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    Quote Originally Posted by Watchingthesky View Post
    Agreed. I have quit listening to Hagee myself, and in the mid-90s I listened to him every chance I got. Even donated to his ministry a time or two. Something has happened regarding him that is troubling to my spirit. I have real trouble with these preachers supposedly getting a word from the Holy Spirit then selling something afterwards or in relation to it. If it's so true and important, how could you demand money for it??
    God bless.
    The part of your post that says something about him is troubling to your spirit, could it be the fact that he divorced/remarried around 1975-1976? Check out wikipedia.
    I always thought that the Bible forbid men from pastoring churches if they had been divorced/remarried. This would trouble my spirit in addition to the sales aspect of their ministry.

  10. #690
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynn View Post
    The part of your post that says something about him is troubling to your spirit, could it be the fact that he divorced/remarried around 1975-1976? Check out wikipedia.
    I always thought that the Bible forbid men from pastoring churches if they had been divorced/remarried. This would trouble my spirit in addition to the sales aspect of their ministry.
    Yes, exactly! I remember reading that and just staring at it. Carrying on an affair with a church goer (his wife now) . . . just unbelievable to me. Of course, he can be forgiven for it and I pray that he has repented, but still . . .

  11. #691
    Barachem Guest

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    What Hal Lindsey on the same page here?
    While i do have some books of his and i do like the comics on his website and have listened to some of his messages on his site, he did divorce several times and is still at TBN and does have some questionable teachings: http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/...ey/lindsey.htm

    OK, he is THE well known teacher about the rapture, but that says nothing to me with regard to heretic and false teachings of his and him divorcing three times.
    While i am grateful for the part that he did play a role in making the rapture more palatable for me, i think the time has long come for me to move on and stay with the biblical teachers.
    Sorry to offend anyone, but what must be said must be said, even if the truth is horribly ugly.

  12. #692
    Final Trumpet Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barachem View Post
    What Hal Lindsey on the same page here?
    While i do have some books of his and i do like the comics on his website and have listened to some of his messages on his site, he did divorce several times and is still at TBN and does have some questionable teachings: http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/...ey/lindsey.htm

    OK, he is THE well known teacher about the rapture, but that says nothing to me with regard to heretic and false teachings of his and him divorcing three times.
    While i am grateful for the part that he did play a role in making the rapture more palatable for me, i think the time has long come for me to move on and stay with the biblical teachers.
    Sorry to offend anyone, but what must be said must be said, even if the truth is horribly ugly.
    Well, I have reservations about him too. He is too friendly with the TBN channel. While I think he is a decent source for news and commentaries, I am very cautious about what he says.

  13. #693
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    A criterion that I always look for in a Bible teacher, whether by radio or in person, is purity of life. If a person has been divorced/remarried several times, they don't make my 'A' list. If a person can't 'keep it together' in their personal life, why do they think they are qualified biblically in the first place to be teaching and leading others? No thanks.

  14. #694
    Glory in print Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by icebear View Post
    what exactly does come out when "tongues" are interpreted?
    I know a few people who sometimes are given the interpretation of there own tongues, they told me that while praying in tongues for awhile the tongues would revert back to english and the english would interpret what was spoken...I know of a guy who records his interpretations on audio tape and has them transcribed so I read some of them and I can say the words were so full of wisdom that it ministered to me just to read them.

  15. #695
    Mopsie Guest

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    After the last thread about speaking in tongues I asked the folks over at "got questions.org" if I could post their work and was approved:

    Question: "What is the gift of speaking in tongues?"

    Answer:
    The first occurrence of speaking in tongues occurred on the Day of Pentecost in Acts 2:1-4. The apostles went out and shared the Gospel with the crowds, speaking to them in their own languages, “we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" (Acts 2:11). The Greek word translated "tongues" literally means "languages." Therefore, the gift of tongues is speaking in a language a person does not know in order to minister to someone who does speak that language. In 1 Corinthians chapters 12-14, where Paul discusses miraculous gifts, he comments that, “Now, brothers, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction?" (1 Corinthians 14:6). According to the Apostle Paul, and in agreement with the tongues described in Acts, speaking in tongues is valuable to the one hearing God’s message in his/her own language, but it is useless to everyone else – unless it is interpreted / translated.

    A person with the gift of interpreting tongues (1 Corinthians 12:30) could understand what a tongues-speaker was saying even though he/she did not know the language that was being spoken. The tongues-interpreter would then communicate the message of the tongues-speaker to everyone else, so all could understand. “For this reason anyone who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret what he says” (1 Corinthians 14:13). Paul’s conclusion regarding un-interpreted tongues is powerful, “But in the church I would rather speak five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue" (1 Corinthians 14:19).

    Is the gift of tongues for today? 1 Corinthians 13:8 mentions the gift of tongues ceasing, although it connects the ceasing with the arrival of the "perfect" in 1 Corinthians 13:10. Some point to a difference in the language in prophecy and knowledge "ceasing" with tongues "being ceased" as evidence for tongues ceasing before the arrival of the "perfect." While possible, this is not explicitly clear from the text. Some also point to passages such as Isaiah 28:11 and Joel 2:28-29 as evidence that speaking in tongues was a sign of God's oncoming judgment. 1 Corinthians 14:22 describes tongues as a "sign to unbelievers." According to this argument, the gift of tongues was a warning to the Jews that God was going to judge Israel for rejecting Jesus Christ as Messiah. Therefore, when God did in fact judge Israel (with the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans in A.D. 70), the gift of tongues would no longer serve its intended purpose. While this view is possible, the primary purpose of tongues being fulfilled does not necessarily demand its cessation. Scripture does not conclusively assert that the gift of speaking in tongues has ceased.

    At the same time, if the gift of speaking in tongues were active in the church today, it would be performed in agreement with Scripture. It would be a real and intelligible language (1 Corinthians 14:10). It would be for the purpose of communicating God's Word with a person of another language (Acts 2:6-12). It would be in agreement with the command that God gave through the Apostle Paul, "If anyone speaks in a tongue, two — or at the most three — should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and God" (1 Corinthians 14:27-28). It would also be in submission to 1 Corinthians 14:33, “For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.”

    God most definitely can give a person the gift of speaking in tongues to enable him/her to communicate with a person who speaks another language. The Holy Spirit is sovereign in the dispersion of the spiritual gifts (1 Corinthians 12:11). Just imagine how much more productive missionaries could be if they didn’t have to go to language school, and were instantly able to speak to people in their own language. However, God does not seem to be doing this. Tongues does not seem to occur today in the form it did in the New Testament despite the fact that it would be immensely useful. The vast majority of believers who claim to practice the gift of speaking in tongues do not do so in agreement with the Scriptures mentioned above. These facts lead to the conclusion that the gift of tongues has ceased, or is at least a rarity in God's plan for the church today.


    Question: "How can I be filled with the Holy Spirit?"

    Answer:
    A key verse that discusses the filling of the Holy Spirit in this age is John 14:16, where Jesus promised the Spirit would indwell believers and that the indwelling would be permanent. It is important to distinguish the indwelling and filling of the Spirit. The permanent indwelling of the Spirit is not for a select few believers, but rather for all believers. There are a number of references in Scripture that supports this conclusion. The first is that the Holy Spirit is a gift given to all believers in Jesus without exception, and no conditions are placed upon this gift except faith in Christ (John 7:37-39). The second is that the Holy Spirit is given at salvation. Ephesians 1:13 indicates that the Holy Spirit is given at the moment of salvation. Galatians 3:2 also emphasizes this same truth, saying that the sealing and indwelling with the Spirit took place at the time of believing. Third, the Holy Spirit indwells believers permanently. The Holy Spirit is given to believers as a down payment, or verification of their future glorification in Christ (2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 4:30).

    This is in contrast to the filling of the Spirit command found in Ephesians 5:18. We should be so completely yielded to the Holy Spirit that He can possess us fully, and in that sense, fill us. Romans 8:9 and Ephesians 1:13-14 state that He dwells within every believer, but He can be grieved (Ephesians 4:30), and His activity within us can be quenched (1 Thessalonians 5:19). When we allow this to happen, we do not experience the fullness of the Holy Spirit's working and power in and through us. To be filled with the Spirit implies freedom for Him to occupy every part of our lives, guiding and controlling us. His power then can be exerted through us so that what we do is fruitful to God. The filling of the Spirit does not apply to outward acts alone; it also applies to the innermost thoughts and motives of our actions. Psalm 19:14 says, "Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable to you, O Lord my strength, and my redeemer."

    Sin is what separates us from the filling of the Holy Spirit, and obedience to God is how the filling of the Spirit is maintained. Although our focus should be to be filled as Ephesians 5:18 commands, praying for the filling of the Holy Spirit is not what accomplishes the filling of the Spirit. Only our obedience to God's commands allows the Spirit freedom to work within us. Because we are sinful creatures, it is impossible to be filled with the Spirit all of the time. We should immediately deal with sin in our lives, and renew our commitment to being Spirit-filled and Spirit-led.

  16. #696
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    Thanks for posting that, Mopsie.
    Discernment is not knowing the difference between right and wrong. It is knowing the difference between right and almost right. - Charles H. Spurgeon

  17. #697
    Mopsie Guest

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    You are very welcome!

  18. #698
    Mopsie Guest

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    Another interesting point that was brought up to me was Romans 8:26:

    26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

    Notice that this is the Holy Spirit groaning to the Father on our behalf. Things that cannot be uttered then are those things which are spoken BY the Holy Spirit - not believers.


  19. #699
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mopsie View Post
    Another interesting point that was brought up to me was Romans 8:26:

    26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

    Notice that this is the Holy Spirit groaning to the Father on our behalf. Things that cannot be uttered then are those things which are spoken BY the Holy Spirit - not believers.

    and they are not even uttered



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  20. #700
    Mopsie Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzardhut View Post
    and they are not even uttered
    I'd hang my head in shame but I know your helping! Thanks for pointing that out!


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