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Thread: Joel Osteen....

  1. #241
    Chuck Taylorz Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by stubob View Post
    Hi Guys,

    I want to pose a question, how do you think Jesus would have answered the question. I think Joel's answer was ok for the audience he was talking to, homosexuality isn't gods best for people the same as fornication, adultery,lust, theft, infact any sin. I have often prayed about how to witness to homosexuals and i've always got the same answer, the same way you'd witness to anyone, tell them about the love of jesus and what he done for all of us and why he had to die and rise again. Christ has forgiven everyone its up to them whether to accept it or not, we as christians are not allowed to judge ppl, we have all sinned, we just need to introduce him. Look at the way Jesus spoke to the samaritan woman at the well. He didn't judge or condem her, he spoke to her in love, thats the way i belive we are supposed deal with people, let them find Jesus and they will come to see what their sin is like to him and that they need him to change their life. love from your brother in scotland
    props!
    i have read a few of his handouts and been on his site.
    He is alright!

  2. #242
    Brinkley Guest

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    God uses different people in different ways. Joel may reach a lot of lost people by directing them to God's "best way" as opposed to some on here yelling and screaming that we need to pound these folks into the ground, body slam them, toss them up in the air and pin them to the count of three.

    Jesus told us to love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, all thy strength and all thy mind and to love thy neighbor as thyself. If we could ever learn to do that, many more would be saved.

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brinkley View Post
    God uses different people in different ways. Joel may reach a lot of lost people by directing them to God's "best way" as opposed to some on here yelling and screaming that we need to pound these folks into the ground, body slam them, toss them up in the air and pin them to the count of three.

    Jesus told us to love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, all thy strength and all thy mind and to love thy neighbor as thyself. If we could ever learn to do that, many more would be saved.
    Swing and a miss. If you think that's our view you need to re read the thread. His doctrine is odd and his presentation of the Gospel is horribly lacking. Should we remain silent?
    There is One King, and He is not this guy.

  4. #244
    4evrHis Guest

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    What Joel did reminds me of an article I read on the internet recently. A reporter named Lexi who has a show on the Christian channel called The Word Network conducted an interview with the gospel singer Tonex. He admitted to being attracted to men & said he did not fight the homosexual urges, but instead gave into them. She did not say anything to him about his lifestyle being a sin & for that she received backlash. Instead she said this
    "It is my belief that a man is made for a woman and a woman is made
    for a man. I believe that the Bible speaks very clearly about this.
    However, as a journalist it is my job to tell the story and as a Christian it
    is my job to love absolutely everybody and I do that unequivocally and
    unapologetically."
    Sort of seems like what Joel did on this view

  5. #245
    Brinkley Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by OnceWasLost View Post
    Swing and a miss. If you think that's our view you need to re read the thread. His doctrine is odd and his presentation of the Gospel is horribly lacking. Should we remain silent?
    I still contend that if people like those on the view are to be reached, Joel will do a better job of getting their attention than would a fire and brimstone, judgmental in your face legalist.

    The Apostle Paul said he became all things to all people that some might be saved.

    Jesus ate with sinners, and was accused of breaking the sabbath, and was rebuked for it by the legalists. His doctrine and "style" was so far out to the point that He was crucified.

    Joel is going where the self righteous will not go.

  6. #246
    Christina Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Taylorz View Post
    props!
    i have read a few of his handouts and been on his site.
    He is alright!
    I guess if all you're looking for is a "feel good" message that doesn't convict because sin and repentence are eliminated, then awayyyyyyyy ya go!

  7. #247
    Christina Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brinkley View Post
    I still contend that if people like those on the view are to be reached, Joel will do a better job of getting their attention than would a fire and brimstone, judgmental in your face legalist.

    The Apostle Paul said he became all things to all people that some might be saved.

    Jesus ate with sinners, and was accused of breaking the sabbath, and was rebuked for it by the legalists. His doctrine and "style" was so far out to the point that He was crucified.

    Joel is going where the self righteous will not go.
    Is that what you truly believe Brinkley?

    Not that John Hagee is viewed as the greatest on this site either BUT if you look at John Hagee's congregation, he has quite a few people that don't seem to mind the "fire and brimstone" teaching.

    No, Joel goes where the money goes.

  8. #248
    Brinkley Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Christina View Post
    Is that what you truly believe Brinkley?

    Not that John Hagee is viewed as the greatest on this site either BUT if you look at John Hagee's congregation, he has quite a few people that don't seem to mind the "fire and brimstone" teaching.

    No, Joel goes where the money goes.
    Not saying "fire and brimstone" is not effective, but it would not be effective to the worldly TV crowd like those on the view. Jesus tells us to love our neighbor, not beat him over the head. Does that mean condoning a certain ungodly lifestyle. No. But different means are used to reach different groups, and the legalists are filled with so much hatred, that they would be angry before they ever got to the stage to present the gospel to the View.

    As for money, Hagee is not exactly in poverty and he uses his program to hawk his wares.

  9. #249
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    I never said Jesus doesn't condem sin, i said he didn't condem her, he spoke to her in love, which is the only way to reach people who are living in sin, lets take the slant off homosexuality
    What slant on homosexuality....??? It is a sin, and wrong..end of story. The question was specifically about homosexuality, not all sin. No need to sugar coat.

    Its says in the bible all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of god, how would you have reacted if, when you weren't a christian someone started quoting bible verses at you about your lifestyle and how its wrong, you prob would have got angry or annoyed and been less likely to listen to what the person had to say about jesus and his gift to us.
    If you wouldn't have listened that is your fault. Joel doesn't preach about sin at Lakewood. When we witness you have to let them know that they are fallen, we all are, and until they repent and leave their sinful life they will forever be separated from God.

    The best way to reach any sinner is to show them love, speak to them in love and yes tell them that you think they're lifestyle is wrong if they ask but temper it with wisdom, and let them know that your not here to judge them or what they are doing and that you love them.
    Trying to show someone the way to salvation is not showing love????
    If you tell them about Jesus, and never tell them that they have to repent of their sins, and leave their sinful life, then, you haven't set that person on the correct walk with God.

  10. #250
    Christina Guest

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    At least Hagee preaches the full Gospel message, sin and repentence and faith in God's Grace, he's not worried about who's toes he steps on. Say it like it is and let the Holy Spirit do the rest.

    It is still possible to preach the full Gospel and do it in a loving way. There are many Pastors out there preaching the full truth and doing it without beating anyone over the head. The problem lies in when you start candy coating the truth or watering it down because you don't want the persons feelings to be hurt....hmmmmmmm, I wonder if Jesus' feelings were ever hurt over the condition of this world, over the way His creation has turned it's back on Him?

    Let's not "recreate" or "up-date" Jesus as a means to be culturaly accepted.

  11. #251
    Christina Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gideon300 View Post
    If you wouldn't have listened that is your fault. Joel doesn't preach about sin at Lakewood. When we witness you have to let them know that they are fallen, we all are, and until they repent and leave their sinful life they will forever be separated from God.


    Trying to show someone the way to salvation is not showing love????
    If you tell them about Jesus, and never tell them that they have to repent of their sins, and leave their sinful life, then, you haven't set that person on the correct walk with God.
    Amen Gideon!!!

  12. #252
    Brinkley Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Christina View Post
    I guess if all you're looking for is a "feel good" message that doesn't convict because sin and repentence are eliminated, then awayyyyyyyy ya go!
    Why would we not want a "feel good" message. What is it about some christians that makes then want to "feel bad." Perhaps unresolved guilt? Jealousy that some christians seem to be getting a pass for their sins?

    Watch Joel Osteen"s opening pre-amble and his closing statement. Joel will be with us in heaven and I would not mind having my mansion next to his and hearing him go out everyday and proclaim how great God is and how He has provided such a beautiful eternal home for us to live in.

    And just imagine if there are people there with us who were watching him on The View and they say that his statements got them to thinking and caused them to repent and seek God.

    Joel is not saying "enjoy your sins". He is saying that God has a better plan, and He does.

  13. #253
    Christina Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brinkley View Post
    Why would we not want a "feel good" message. What is it about some christians that makes then want to "feel bad." Perhaps unresolved guilt? Jealousy that some christians seem to be getting a pass for their sins?

    Watch Joel Osteen"s opening pre-amble and his closing statement. Joel will be with us in heaven and I would not mind having my mansion next to his and hearing him go out everyday and proclaim how great God is and how he has provided such a beautiful eternal home for us to live in.

    And just imagine if there are people there with us who were watching him on the view and they say that his statements got them to thinking and caused them to repent and seek God.

    Joel is not saying "enjoy your sins". He is saying that God has a better plan, and He does.
    Who said anything about feeling bad Brinkley, you're missing the issue. The thing is when you deliver "feel good" messages there is very little conviction of sin. People start making justifications for the sin in their life as a way to continue living in it without feeling there's anything wrong with it. Let's not go to extremes here, yes God is love but God is also just. Being a child if God is not just about getting saved and that's it, there is a whole life with Christ that comes after. Yes, we are convicted by the Holy Spirit but if people are continuously made to "feel good" rather than being told sin is sin, they are likely to quench the movement and nudging of the Holy Spirit, this way they can continue to live their lives as they please with no guilt for the sin in their lives.

    Why is it that there seems to be this mentality that you can't rebuke a person's sin and do it with love? Since when is rebuking someone's sin equate to not loving the person? I WANT my sin pointed out to me (in a loving manner) because I don't always see things the way others do and if there's something that I don't see that needs to be brought to the Lord, I want to know about it, I want my walk with the Lord to be as close as possible. It's not about needing to feel bad, it's about teaching that sin is sin and it needs to be layed at the feet of Jesus so that He can cleanse us of it and change us from within. What good is it if the person is made to "feel good" about their sin as if "oh well, it's not that big a deal because hey, Jesus loves me"...that's right, Jesus loves us and because of that we should be striving to be as close to Him as possible even if that means my toes will be stepped on to point out sin in my life.

    "Feel good" messages just allow people to stay in the state their in.

  14. #254
    Brinkley Guest

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    Get right sinner or face judgment!!

    Come unto me all ye who are heavy laden and I will give you rest.

    I just believe the second method works best.

  15. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brinkley View Post
    I still contend that if people like those on the view are to be reached, Joel will do a better job of getting their attention than would a fire and brimstone, judgmental in your face legalist.

    The Apostle Paul said he became all things to all people that some might be saved.

    Jesus ate with sinners, and was accused of breaking the sabbath, and was rebuked for it by the legalists. His doctrine and "style" was so far out to the point that He was crucified.

    Joel is going where the self righteous will not go.
    Why must it be an either or, are you not aware you can speak the undiluted truth without fire and brimstone? Oversimplification by joel or you is not at all helpful or accurate.

    An answer like this could do both.

    "God said in His word that homosexuality is a sin and He tells us that there is consequence for sin. We will all be judged for our sin some day, homosexuality is a lifestyle that stands in opposition to His word.

    The good news is we have the assurance that Jesus gave His life that we may have forgiveness for sin. There is no need to live in a place of opposition to His will, because He died to free us from this condition. Homosexuality is a big issue today since politically it is always a focus and stirs emotions on both sides of the issue.

    Homosexuality, as any other sin is enough for us to need forgiveness. We can be free from whatever sin we commit if we have received forgiveness through Jesus Christ. He has called us to leave our lifestyles and become new creations in Him."


    No fire, no brimstone, no foaming at the mouth preacher, no slick, wishy washy religion. Rather a simple Gospel message that can draw people to a loving God through the Cross. So what's wrong with that?
    There is One King, and He is not this guy.

  16. #256
    Chuck Taylorz Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by OnceWasLost View Post
    Why must it be an either or, are you not aware you can speak the undiluted truth without fire and brimstone? Oversimplification by joel or you is not at all helpful or accurate.
    I'm kinda lost with the above..please clarify..

  17. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brinkley View Post
    Get right sinner or face judgment!!

    Come unto me all ye who are heavy laden and I will give you rest.

    I just believe the second method works best.
    So, Brinkley you don't let people know that they are living in sin at all? The two lines you used are saying saying primarily the same thing. Most people unfamiliar with the Bible will not have a clue by what you are saying with the line you like to use. What happens when they ask what that means? Do you dance around the fact that if they don't accept Christ they are forever separated from God?

  18. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Taylorz View Post
    I'm kinda lost with the above..please clarify..
    Pretty simple. OWL is saying that we can be loving when we witness, and at the same time tell them that they will be separated from God (go to Hell) if we choose not to accept Jesus as our savior.

    The fact is, by showing someone the way to salvation through Jesus is the greatest love we can show for another human being.

  19. #259
    Chuck Taylorz Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gideon300 View Post
    Pretty simple. OWL is saying that we can be loving when we witness, and at the same time tell them that they will be separated from God (go to Hell) if we choose not to accept Jesus as our savior.

    The fact is, by showing someone the way to salvation through Jesus is the greatest love we can show for another human being.
    ok.

  20. #260
    His Bride Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gideon300 View Post
    Pretty simple. OWL is saying that we can be loving when we witness, and at the same time tell them that they will be separated from God (go to Hell) if we choose not to accept Jesus as our savior.

    The fact is, by showing someone the way to salvation through Jesus is the greatest love we can show for another human being.
    By not sharing the Truth about salvation, we are being unloving!

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