Muslims irate with Christian protestors

[NoProvision]

Good grief! The behavior of those children is shocking but no surprise. The police there are either cowards or there's some agenda they are following that allows this kind of assault to occur. I wonder what happened after they were pulled over by 12 cops? Why were they pulled over while being escorted by the police? Who's watching the cotton candy stand at that point? Oy!

Well, in light of the 40+ minutes of edited-out material I can now understand how things got so heated. The hog's head was a very foolish idea and it was dishonest to edit that out and feign unprovoked victimhood.

[Acts5:41]

I don't usually talk about what I do on a daily basis.

However, today, the paratransit company hired a regular cab driver to pick us up. It was clear from his accent, name, and prayer rug that he was muslim. I gave him a New Testament (with a few tracts) in a bag of candy. My husband gave him a tract he wrote. We also gave him a nice tip and talked to him all the way home. The driver was thrilled. He specifically said, if our name came up on the computer again, he'd take the trip.

Clearly, we didn't get stoned.

If we allow ourselves to be guided by the Holy Spirit, there is a HUGE harvest out amongst the muslims. However, we have to ask God to guide us in our approach. We have to focus on the recipient and not our own needs.

And who knows, we may see that guy up in heaven after the rapture.

Don't forget to pray for all the unreached. They're going to hell!

[Florian9]

If we allow ourselves to be guided by the Holy Spirit, there is a HUGE harvest out amongst the muslims. However, we have to ask God to guide us in our approach. We have to focus on the recipient and not our own needs.

And who knows, we may see that guy up in heaven after the rapture.

Don't forget to pray for all the unreached. They're going to hell!

I know muslims are in the exact same place I used to be (all of us were once there)--hellbound. I make it a point to pray for the lost muslims at least twice a week. Believe it or not they are probably easier to reach than your average apostate westerner. If you don't come across as an overly pious jerk but with love, most will listen to you. My heart does weigh heavily for them though--regardless of the evil their religion and their cultures promote or destroy.

[Acts5:41]

That's been my experience, Florian.

I will NOT put myself out there as any kind of expert, but, with God's leading, I find myself treating them with respect and courtesy, listening to them, sharing a little treat maybe, and they are very willing to hear our testimony, take tracts, and a New Testament.

I used to think if I even mentioned my faith they'd GET me, but that has not been my experience. Of course, God leads them to me, when they're at the moment when they WILL accept the testimony, tract, and New Testament. It is very important to work in God's will and His guidance.

I would never just show up at a mosque on a Friday night and try to hand stuff out.

That would go - badly.

[TimothyK]

#1 Question is why was the video edited the way it was?

Because they didn't want everyone to really see they were intentionally being incendiary. We know that.

In the unedited version you will see that (1) the police DID intervene (multiple times) and even carried someone off

At what time stamps? Are you referring to the one police officer who told a kid to settle down? He wasn't carried off. The police officer after the fact made a speedy retreat off camera. You can still see the kid in the crowd after the fact.

That's once I can see, and it's a really pathetic attempt.

Why did the police officers leave in general? Surely they knew it was going to escalate if they left?

(2) that Ruben's group was parading around with a pig's head (VERY offensive to Muslims)

Yup.

(3) that adult Muslims were seen trying (in vain) multiple times to intervene and protect the protesters

Where? What time marks? I see several 'youths' who seem to be young adults joining the fun. No ones trying to defend the Christian protesters.

The older adults are seen on camera far to the fringes not lifting a finger or saying a thing to the youths.

(4) at 49:00 Ruben Israel tells a police officer that they brought the pig head to "protect" themselves. The cop doesn't buy it and neither do I.

Don't think I buy it either. But it would be a viable strategy if that were the case, pretty clever if that's so. However that's combat thinking, not evangelism.

If the goal is evangelism, indeed, they fail in that regard.

Furthermore, Ruben Israel is shown disobeying authority by refusing to leave after they had provoked the crowd into a frenzy.

No he's not. He didn't refuse to leave. He and his group are on film leaving. He contended the grounds, but he left when it was made clear the issue was settled.

He and his party did not have to be forcibly removed.

Remember that God sees everything. We may be able to deceive other Christians but we can't deceive God. The very fact that the video was edited to show the group in a good light brings to question the editor's motive & heart condition.

Agreed.

[BarbT]

Meanwhile .... the devil is laughing himself silly over Christians behaving badly and the other Christians who blast them.

I'm counting on the fact that through the chaos of this event God reached at least ONE Muslim who read a scripture sign or glimpsed a Jesus t-shirt that quietly pierced his/her heart. If one seed was planted that day it was worth it.

[TimothyK]

Meanwhile .... the devil is laughing himself silly over Christians behaving badly and the other Christians who blast them.

I'm counting on the fact that through the chaos of this event God reached at least ONE Muslim who read a scripture sign or glimpsed a Jesus t-shirt that quietly pierced his/her heart. If one seed was planted that day it was worth it.

On the mark.

[Anymomentnow]

Meanwhile .... the devil is laughing himself silly over Christians behaving badly and the other Christians who blast them.

I'm counting on the fact that through the chaos of this event God reached at least ONE Muslim who read a scripture sign or glimpsed a Jesus t-shirt that quietly pierced his/her heart. If one seed was planted that day it was worth it.

Yep I agree.
We should all pray for all involved in this event.
Pray for the Muslims who the Holy Spirit is convicting of sin and righteousness and judgement to come.
Pray for the Christuan group that they will seek God's wisdom before ever trying a stunt like this again.
Pray for the media who witnessed the whole thing that they will report truthfully what happened.
Pray that our Lord and Saviour will work all of this for good to those who love Him and are the called according to His purposes.
Pray that this never happens again.

[RandallB]

....

I will NOT put myself out there as any kind of expert, but, with God's leading, I find myself treating them with respect and courtesy, listening to them, sharing a little treat maybe, and they are very willing to hear our testimony, take tracts, and a New Testament.

I used to think if I even mentioned my faith they'd GET me, but that has not been my experience. Of course, God leads them to me, when they're at the moment when they WILL accept the testimony, tract, and New Testament. It is very important to work in God's will and His guidance.

I would never just show up at a mosque on a Friday night and try to hand stuff out.

That would go - badly.

This has also been my experience. (Although I realize that this is not universal.)

We hosted a Muslim refugee family for Bosnia years ago. They had 2 adorable daughters about 3 & 5. They went to church with us and accepted what we witnessed to them. They may have felt obligated to because we were their host family but still I pray that seeds were planted.

We also have given a track to an elderly Iraqi man who needed a ride home from the food bank that we were helping in. His daughter in law was very appreciative for the help when we got him home... We will find next month if the Arabic track we gave him will cause problems.

I feel if we meet them at a personal level they are shocked that all the things that they have been told about us Christians are maybe not true.

I feel that it is the God of Love that draws them.

They just do not have that.

His Love overpowers them.

[tardisdoctor]

This has also been my experience. (Although I realize that this is not universal.)

We hosted a Muslim refugee family for Bosnia years ago. They had 2 adorable daughters about 3 & 5. They went to church with us and accepted what we witnessed to them. They may have felt obligated to because we were their host family but still I pray that seeds were planted.

We also have given a track to an elderly Iraqi man who needed a ride home from the food bank that we were helping in. His daughter in law was very appreciative for the help when we got him home... We will find next month if the Arabic track we gave him will cause problems.

I feel if we meet them at a personal level they are shocked that all the things that they have been told about us Christians are maybe not true.

I feel that it is the God of Love that draws them.

They just do not have that.

His Love overpowers them.

+1

[lovePsalm40]

Samer Hijazi of The Arab American News wrote a very insightful story on the Christian confrontation with Muslims.

http://www.arabamericannews.com/news...y&article=5781


Ruben Israel's group shot a total of 67 minutes of raw footage of the festival which was later edited down to the 22 minute video that went viral. You can see what happened from the time they walked toward the festival with the camera running until the time they departed. The long version will show you a more thorough portrayal of the events as they transpired. I would urge all to watch at least the first 5-10 minutes.

Arab International Festival 2012 Dearborn Michigan 1:06:58

Thank you!! I put this on my blog and appreciate the helpful information. God bless, Ann

[Raphael]

"The medium is the message." -Marshall McLuhan

[Buzzardhut]

http://www.chick.com/articles/tracts_quietly_seeded.asp

This year, the Arab International Festival in Dearborn, Michigan was again targeted by two types of Christians. And the news media picked up both stories. In one, Christian “protesters” charged in waving confronting signs and placards and carrying a pig’s head on a pole. The other was Tim Berends, a six-foot-tall guy wearing a warm smile and a I-(heart)-Muslims T-shirt.

While the “protesters” were ducking rocks and bottles, Tim quietly moved through the crowds handing out Chick tracts to booth keepers and spectators alike. By the end of the 3-day festival, that attracted over 300,000 attendees, he had salted 4000 copies of the tract, Unforgiven into the hands of mostly Muslim people.

The T-shirt, with “John 9:35-38” on the back, attracted much attention with some Muslims asking where they could get one. Tim would walk against the flow greeting people with a smile and the Arab greeting, “As-Salamu Alaykum (pronounced, aah suh laah mu aah lay kum) which means "peace be upon you" and hand them a tract. Often a family would approach and the father would ignore Tim but, behind her husband’s back, the wife would reach for the tract.

One young lady demanded why he was there trying to cram the Bible down their throat. He replied: “I truly believe in heaven and I truly believe in hell. I wouldn’t be here if I didn’t believe that Jesus said, ‘I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh to the Father but by me.’ But I love Muslims and want them to come to trust Jesus.” This “soft answer” turned away her “wrath” and she wandered off.

The group of Christians who wore T-shirts and carried signs with scriptures immediately drew a hostile crowd. When the crowd got unruly, they requested police protection and were told there were not enough officers available. The crowd became abusive, shouting profanities and throwing rocks, bottles, and eggs. Eventually the Christians were escorted out and threatened with citations for “disorderly conduct.”

Last year, Tim used the same quiet, unobtrusive technique to distribute 1800 tracts at the festival while the same group used confrontation and met with similar resistance. Tim demonstrated that sometimes it is better to be “wise as serpents and harmless as doves.”

The news media covered both approaches. One showed pictures of the rioters attacking the Christians with the signs. The other was a picture of Tim, standing tall in his I-(heart)-Muslims T-shirt, offering a tract and a smile to a teenage girl wrapped in a scarf. She is smiling back before reaching for the tract.

Granted, Jesus spoke harsh condemnation on the hypocrites of His day for making their converts “twofold more the child of hell than themselves.” Most of the ones shouting obscenities and throwing things at the Christians were teens and young people. Would they not have been included when Jesus sat on a hill overlooking Jerusalem and wept for her children? He roundly castigated the leaders, but bemoaned the fact that the common people on the street were like sheep without a shepherd. There is no doubt that sinners need to be confronted with the gospel. However, it is better for the soul winner to show Christ’s compassion while delivering the message and let the tract do the confronting, later at a more private time.

Tim believes that the hundreds of tracts that he was able to quietly put into the hands of the multitude will do much to point the precious Muslim men and oppressed Muslim women away from the hateful god Allah, into the loving arms of the Lord Jesus.

http://www.freep.com/article/2012061...rborn-festival

[Acts5:41]

Way to go, Tim!

I did a handout tonight, and a muslim man walked by. I waved at him and smiled, then offered him a Bible.

He THOUGHT about it, then regretfully declined.

That's OK, I'm out there tomorrow.

[imfree]

"Tim believes that the hundreds of tracts that he was able to quietly put into the hands of the multitude will do much to point the precious Muslim men and oppressed Muslim women away from the hateful god Allah, into the loving arms of the Lord Jesus."

==========

Good for Tim! No THAT's how it's done!

[Watchingthesky]

Well, that was absolutely horrifying. We just witnessed on a small scale what muslims will do once they reach sufficient numbers. "You're not welcome in Dearborn"???? Wow. America better wise up before it's too late. Dearborn is just one small step away from becoming a place where law enforcement won't even go any longer, and when that happens, Shariah Law gets established. It's soon to come to Dearborn, and then the country after that.

Anyone who has any honesty in them should be absolutely appalled by that video. The gentleman at the end was absolutely right - all the "law enforcement officers" did was reward riotous behavior. A terrible precedent was set and it will likely soon cost some of those very officers their lives.

God bless those folks for having the courage to stand there and put up with that. They remained calm and collected.

I'm a little numb right now, thinking that this is actually happening in my country. Dearborn is all but lost and it will be the example of what is planned for a larger scale once muslim numbers reach more sufficient levels.

May Our Lord not tarry.

God bless.

[TimothyK]

http://www.chick.com/articles/tracts_quietly_seeded.asp

This year, the Arab International Festival in Dearborn, Michigan was again targeted by two types of Christians. And the news media picked up both stories. In one, Christian “protesters” charged in waving confronting signs and placards and carrying a pig’s head on a pole. The other was Tim Berends, a six-foot-tall guy wearing a warm smile and a I-(heart)-Muslims T-shirt.

While the “protesters” were ducking rocks and bottles, Tim quietly moved through the crowds handing out Chick tracts to booth keepers and spectators alike. By the end of the 3-day festival, that attracted over 300,000 attendees, he had salted 4000 copies of the tract, Unforgiven into the hands of mostly Muslim people.

The T-shirt, with “John 9:35-38” on the back, attracted much attention with some Muslims asking where they could get one. Tim would walk against the flow greeting people with a smile and the Arab greeting, “As-Salamu Alaykum (pronounced, aah suh laah mu aah lay kum) which means "peace be upon you" and hand them a tract. Often a family would approach and the father would ignore Tim but, behind her husband’s back, the wife would reach for the tract.

One young lady demanded why he was there trying to cram the Bible down their throat. He replied: “I truly believe in heaven and I truly believe in hell. I wouldn’t be here if I didn’t believe that Jesus said, ‘I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh to the Father but by me.’ But I love Muslims and want them to come to trust Jesus.” This “soft answer” turned away her “wrath” and she wandered off.

The group of Christians who wore T-shirts and carried signs with scriptures immediately drew a hostile crowd. When the crowd got unruly, they requested police protection and were told there were not enough officers available. The crowd became abusive, shouting profanities and throwing rocks, bottles, and eggs. Eventually the Christians were escorted out and threatened with citations for “disorderly conduct.”

Last year, Tim used the same quiet, unobtrusive technique to distribute 1800 tracts at the festival while the same group used confrontation and met with similar resistance. Tim demonstrated that sometimes it is better to be “wise as serpents and harmless as doves.”

The news media covered both approaches. One showed pictures of the rioters attacking the Christians with the signs. The other was a picture of Tim, standing tall in his I-(heart)-Muslims T-shirt, offering a tract and a smile to a teenage girl wrapped in a scarf. She is smiling back before reaching for the tract.

Granted, Jesus spoke harsh condemnation on the hypocrites of His day for making their converts “twofold more the child of hell than themselves.” Most of the ones shouting obscenities and throwing things at the Christians were teens and young people. Would they not have been included when Jesus sat on a hill overlooking Jerusalem and wept for her children? He roundly castigated the leaders, but bemoaned the fact that the common people on the street were like sheep without a shepherd. There is no doubt that sinners need to be confronted with the gospel. However, it is better for the soul winner to show Christ’s compassion while delivering the message and let the tract do the confronting, later at a more private time.

Tim believes that the hundreds of tracts that he was able to quietly put into the hands of the multitude will do much to point the precious Muslim men and oppressed Muslim women away from the hateful god Allah, into the loving arms of the Lord Jesus.

http://www.freep.com/article/2012061...rborn-festival

This is how you do it. Well done. Ruben Israel's group should take notes!

1 Peter 2:15-20
For it is God’s will and intention that by doing right [your good and honest lives] should silence (muzzle, gag) the ignorant charges and ill-informed criticisms of foolish persons.

[Live] as free people, [yet] without employing your freedom as a pretext for wickedness; but [live at all times] as servants of God.

Show respect for all men [treat them honorably]. Love the brotherhood (the Christian fraternity of which Christ is the Head). Reverence God. Honor the emperor.

[You who are] household servants, be submissive to your masters with all [proper] respect, not only to those who are kind and considerate and reasonable, but also to those who are surly (overbearing, unjust, and crooked).

For one is regarded favorably (is approved, acceptable, and thankworthy) if, as in the sight of God, he endures the pain of unjust suffering.

[After all] what kind of glory [is there in it] if, when you do wrong and are punished for it, you take it patiently?

But if you bear patiently with suffering [which results] when you do right and that is undeserved, it is acceptable and pleasing to God.

That said:

Well, that was absolutely horrifying. We just witnessed on a small scale what muslims will do once they reach sufficient numbers. "You're not welcome in Dearborn"???? Wow. America better wise up before it's too late. Dearborn is just one small step away from becoming a place where law enforcement won't even go any longer, and when that happens, Shariah Law gets established. It's soon to come to Dearborn, and then the country after that.

Anyone who has any honesty in them should be absolutely appalled by that video. The gentleman at the end was absolutely right - all the "law enforcement officers" did was reward riotous behavior. A terrible precedent was set and it will likely soon cost some of those very officers their lives.

God bless those folks for having the courage to stand there and put up with that. They remained calm and collected.

I'm a little numb right now, thinking that this is actually happening in my country. Dearborn is all but lost and it will be the example of what is planned for a larger scale once muslim numbers reach more sufficient levels.

May Our Lord not tarry.

God bless.

My sentiments are with Watchingthesky and my sympathy remains with Ruben Israel's group. They're still our brothers in Jesus Christ and they suffered.

If your brother or sister does something stupid and suffers for it, do you console the enemy of your sibling? Or your sibling? Is it right to patch up your brothers enemy before your own brother?

Should you not tend to your sister first who was abused before you tend to her abuser? The young men who stoned the awful Christians left none the worse for wear, beyond their sensibilities being offended.

I see a lot of folks who's sympathies are with the angry mob, but I see few who have sympathy for the ones being stoned.. among other things...

They get no credit or glory for being stupid, but they still deserve to be treated like human beings.

Is that the case here?

[Acts5:41]

I agree.

It's like a kid throwing rocks at a wasp nest. You're sorry he got stung, but you still want to smack him.

It also harms future evangelism opportunities. I have never met a muslim who converted because someone waved a pig head and shouted at them.

I have met a lot of Muslims, who thoughtfully told me they really like the "Little book" (scripture booklet) I gave them with some candy.

The Holy Spirit leads me to act in love and consideration for the recipient. I can't speak for others.

[TimothyK]

It's like a kid throwing rocks at a wasp nest. You're sorry he got stung, but you still want to smack him.

It also harms future evangelism opportunities. I have never met a muslim who converted because someone waved a pig head and shouted at them.

I have met a lot of Muslims, who thoughtfully told me they really like the "Little book" (scripture booklet) I gave them with some candy.

The Holy Spirit leads me to act in love and consideration for the recipient. I can't speak for others.

Yeah. Those poor wasps. Shame on you, kid!



I'm sorry.
That just doesn't ring true to me.

[Acts5:41]

From a completely secular viewpoint, let's look at what works:

Prayer for Muslims.
Bible Distribution.
Forgiving our enemies, loving them, praying for them.
Showing God's love to them.

Let's look at what the protesters did: shouting, yelling, "we are better" "You are wrong". Taking something the "recipients" found highly offensive and waving it around.

That doesn't match the list, eh?

Look at the two groups; who actually did sowing? The man walking around with the "I Heart Muslims" Shirt; not the group of "haters".

It's not logical to take an approach that won't work; unless the goal is not what they've stated.

IE - they WANTED to be victims; they didn't want to reach the unreached.

The guy who wanted to reach them, did.