Is the Rapture Index Date Framing?

[OnlyHIM!]

To my surprise yesterday at church, our pastor referenced the Rapture Index he came across on the Rapture Ready website. He, as well as our church, believes in a pre-trib rapture. We have been studying 1 Thes. and the rapture has been discussed as well. While he did not directly critisize the Index, I could tell he might not have fully understood what it is saying. To be honest, I have thought it does come dangerously close to date framing. He read the description posted that tells what the Index is suppose to be saying, but as he did, I could easily see where some might think that an attempt was being made to indicate when the rapture could take place.

I have spent the last 12 years following RR so I do understand its' intentions. RR is a website for watchers and while we do not know the time or dates Jesus did give us a command to watch and a list of characteristics of what the world would look like when He does final rapture us al home. The Index is simply guaging the speed at which prophesy is being fulfilled in the world, at least how we interpret it. I also am aware that this forum operates under different rules, specifically stating no date framing.

After hearing our pastor speak about this yesterday, I have to admit I was uncomfortable and it has me a little concerned that some people may be mis-led a bit with the Index even though there are good intentions (of which he did say in the end). What do you guys think?

[Wally]

I think it will drop to 34 before it goes to the preverbial handbasket.

[EarsToHear]

You answered your own question in your second paragraph. It's sign watching, not date framing. Dates for the Rapture are never given here at RR.

[Wally]

Yea, but then most dating services are unreliable.......

[OnlyHIM!]

You answered your own question in your second paragraph. It's sign watching, not date framing. Dates for the Rapture are never given here at RR.

I was just pointing out that yes, I understand it is not suppose to be, but I am concerned that others might not see it that way and could it be doing more harm than good.

Here is the exact wording that has me concerned a little. It does clearly state that it is not intended to "predict" the rapture, but it seems to be an index that suggests a period of time more condusive to the rapture. It would seem to me some could interpret that as "indicating or tracking a time period that the rapture is more likely to occur " than not.

The Purpose For This Index
The Rapture Index has two functions: one is to factor together a number of related end time components into a cohesive indicator, and the other is to standardize those components to eliminate the wide variance that currently exists with prophecy reporting.

The Rapture Index is by no means meant to predict the rapture, however, the index is designed to measure the type of activity that could act as a precursor to the rapture.
You could say the Rapture index is a Dow Jones Industrial Average of end time activity, but I think it would be better if you viewed it as prophetic speedometer. The higher the number, the faster we're moving towards the occurrence of pre-tribulation rapture.

Wouldn't it seem the rapture Index would be likely at zero or very low when the rapture occurs?

[Raphael]

You make a good point and I have received some ribbing at the office for the Index because it numerically scores present situations and can give the impression that we are saying the Rapture is "more imminent" at a "high" point.

The Index's strong suit is that it highlights current events in light of Bible prophecy, and alerts us to which events are actually cited in scripture as "end time" happenings.

[HeIsEnough]

We are fully encouraged and exhorted from scripture to recognize the season. I see the index as fitting into this context. Setting and framing have real date's in mind.

[OnlyHIM!]

You make a good point and I have received some ribbing at the office for the Index because it numerically scores present situations and can give the impression that we are saying the Rapture is "more imminent" at a "high" point.

The Index's strong suit is that it highlights current events in light of Bible prophecy, and alerts us to which events are actually cited in scripture as "end time" happenings.

Yeah, this is kind of how I felt on Sunday, almost a little embarrased by it. I do agree with what it does symbolize.

[OnlyHIM!]

We are fully encouraged and exhorted from scripture to recognize the season. I see the index as fitting into this context. Setting and framing have real date's in mind.

Should I say something to our Pastor do you think? Part of me wants to at least shed a little more light on the reasoning behind it in all fairness, the other part wonders if it is really that important to make an issue of it?

[HeIsEnough]

Todd is a member here, pm him, he wont mind. You can look to where the Lord tells us to pay heed to the signs of times, and tell your pastor that it is a help towards that end.

[Verisimilitude]

Mark 24:32-33 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

Mark 13:28-30 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.


The rapture index never sets a date. It doesn't bother me, and I don't know why it would bother anyone else on that basis.

Jesus gave us signs to look for, and told us to "know". Not guess, not assume, not hypothesize, not postulate, not take a shot in the dark, but to know, not only when it's near, but when it's right at the doors!

The world thinks that it's business as usual out there. We know different. Our Lord commanded us to know and we do know. Should we consider it wrong to know as our Lord commanded? Should we not warn the world that the end of the age is truly mere moments away, (relatively speaking), because anyone feels that recognizing the nearness is the same as date setting? I say no!

I look at what Jesus said. At look at the warning signs He gave. I look especially at the "this generation shall not pass..." verse and I know that we as believers are wonderfully close, and that non-believers are painfully close. Rather than warning the congregation against date setting, which has nothing to do with the rapture index, this pastor should be warning his congregation of how near the end of the age actually is, and entreating them to go out to unbelievers and spread not only the Good News of the Kingdom, but the warning of the tribulation that is right around the corner.

[grace-saved]

Mark 24:32-33 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

Mark 13:28-30 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.


The rapture index never sets a date. It doesn't bother me, and I don't know why it would bother anyone else on that basis.

Jesus gave us signs to look for, and told us to "know". Not guess, not assume, not hypothesize, not postulate, not take a shot in the dark, but to know, not only when it's near, but when it's right at the doors!

The world thinks that it's business as usual out there. We know different. Our Lord commanded us to know and we do know. Should we consider it wrong to know as our Lord commanded? Should we not warn the world that the end of the age is truly mere moments away, (relatively speaking), because anyone feels that recognizing the nearness is the same as date setting? I say no!

I look at what Jesus said. At look at the warning signs He gave. I look especially at the "this generation shall not pass..." verse and I know that we as believers are wonderfully close, and that non-believers are painfully close. Rather than warning the congregation against date setting, which has nothing to do with the rapture index, this pastor should be warning his congregation of how near the end of the age actually is, and entreating them to go out to unbelievers and spread not only the Good News of the Kingdom, but the warning of the tribulation that is right around the corner.

Amen! This post brought tears to my eyes, Verisimilitude. We do know, don't we.... How wonderful our God is.

[OnlyHIM!]

I am sorry, I did not intend to create an issue, just a discussion. I can assure anyone that our Pastor is and our Church is focused on making and training disciples and alerting the lost as to the times we live in. I just wanted to bring up an issue with how the Rapture Index was being interpreted by some Pre-Trib Belivers and that it might be turning others away at first glance from this very important site. I just wondered if anyone else saw this or not.

[treasures]

The Rapture Index reminds me less of a date setting device and more of a rudimentary cardiotocograph of the signs, and I also think that Todd errs on the side of extreme caution in that as well, though there will always be those who will take just anything and everything they can and do with that exactly what they are not to do..which is date setting.

[carol1948]

IMO the Rapture Index is not date framing, but perhaps it could be more accurately named Tribulation Index since the signs we are watching are for the coming tribulation that occurs after the Rapture. Most of us know that, but new believers and unbelievers may not.

[Bubbeto4]

I think the RR Index is more like a weather report on conditions all over the globe. As weather patterns change all the time RR is keeping us on tract of what's going on as those "conditions" change.

Just like weather you can see the signs-but you can't set an exact date or time when the storm will reach you.

In Matthew 16:3 it refers to seeing the signs of weather to predict storms and how we should decern the signs of His coming. I think that includes
RR index-showing the signs...it's the job of the "watchmen" on the wall.

Jesus said you can not know "the day or the hour". That's pretty specific.

(Not to start anything here, but It's never the same day or hour across the globe! Can we tell what month or year or season? Just curious).

I've haven't seen an exact date predicted here.

[Hootmon]

IMO the Rapture Index is not date framing, but perhaps it could be more accurately named Tribulation Index since the signs we are watching are for the coming tribulation that occurs after the Rapture. Most of us know that, but new believers and unbelievers may not.

+1