Results 1 to 20 of 24

Thread: Having trouble again

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    528

    Default Having trouble again

    I have trouble with my salvation. I am going back and forth between being saved and going to hell for unbelief. It doesn't seem to help no matter what I read on the assurance of salvation. I will be reading and then it will hit me that I'm truly saved and then the enemy comes and tells me it's not really true that I am saved. Its like I have OCD about my salvation. I have a settled peace for a day or two and then it's back to being dammed to hell forever. I could not stand to be sent away from the LORD, this upsets me greatly!! Is this working out my salvation?? Sometimes I have absolute terror at this thought. I have been struggling with this for years, sometimes better sometimes worse but it's always there at the back of my mind. If I am still struggling with this it probably means I don't trust what Gods word says, it seems so simple and yet the most difficult thing to have the full assurance of salvation.

    I am out of work for about 6 months and I feel useless, hopeless and frustrated. I'm 55 and have no real skills just general labor. I would like to work but it's difficult to get a job at this age. But God has sustained my wife and I this long. I want this whole life just to be over it's been very painful and I don't know what to do. The evil I see going on in our country is almost to much to bear and I don't go out much anymore because I just don't want to be a part of this society anymore.

    Any thoughts or comments would be welcome at this point, I need help.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts
    1,164

    Default

    We are humans. That will always make our "salvation" confusing. Plus we live in a world where we are attacked from every angle, even other "Christians" with their judgement of if you are saved or not. That's one of the horrors of this sin filled world.

    John 3:16

    I am like you in a sense I've "unplugged" from the world. I don't share the same interests as others (drinking and partying) and don't even use Facebook anymore. Alot of noise and destractions.

    I'm sorry about your work issue and will pray for you! It's challenging for sure. But God and Jesus loves you!!

    Luke 21:28

    John 4:16

    16 And so we know and rely on the love God has for us.

    God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them.
    s
    Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    129

    Default

    Praying for you, Dave.

    I think we all have experience doubt sometimes... even if not as intensely as you describe, the occasional "what if...".

    It sounds like you're well versed in all the reasons why the matter is settled and your future is secure, so I won't attempt to link to a bunch of verses proving that unless you feel there's a need. Sometimes, I think it's just an intellectual decision where you tell yourself that you've done your research, looked at the evidence, reached a conclusion, and made a decision and are sticking by it. Just old fashioned stubbornness. Then when the doubt starts to creep in, tell yourself (and the enemy) that the matter is settled and you trust in Jesus and what He did for you. It's as simple and hard as that.

    I'm sure you've already thought of this, but a God that cares enough to come here, suffer horribly and die for your and me isn't about to let anyone willing to come to him slip through His fingers. He wants all to be saved.

    This morning on the way in to work I was listening to the message Amir Tsarfati gave on the Rapture in the Philippines a few days ago and at the end the local pastor led the entire congregation through his version of the sinner's prayer. Not that anyone who already said it needed to say it again, but it was for those there who were newly accepting Christ and for those who already have done that as a kind of support for those making that decision. Driving along in the car, I repeated along -- not as a petition, but as a declaration of faith. I think sometimes maybe we just need to remind ourselves of the simple truth of who we belong to and be grateful.

    Again, praying for you. Our hope grows nearer every day!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    4,424

    Default

    Believe God's word that there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.
    That old serpent is still using his old playbook to cast doubt.
    Maybe read Genesis again - the part where he tempted Eve.
    The dogs are barking, someone is knocking on the door...

    Please pray for Lindsey's salvation

  5. #5

    Default

    I was just like that in the past. Errily similiar. I found out from my therapist that I was predisposed to OCD. Remember the saving faith is a gift from god. This article will help you reassure http://https://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/do-i-have-enough-faith/

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Midwest
    Posts
    4,506

    Default

    There have been many, many people on this board who have had the same issue, including me. But, if you read, & then read again the gospel of John, I think it will benefit you more than someone else's 'take' on whether or not you have salvation. Only God's Spirit through His Word can say what's true in any of us. Trust Him to show you. Another part of Scripture that helped me was where Jesus said, 'if you love Me, you will keep My commandments.' I truly 'love' to obey Him, no matter what it is. Lost people aren't ready to do whatever He asks, especially if it involves a lot of personal sacrifice. Also, read Colossians in its entirety. Allow God Himself to give you assurance. Assurance based on the ideas/writings of another fallen creature just like yourself will not give lasting assurance, as you've discovered.

    -Lynn

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    3,722

    Default

    Quit listening to the enemy. All the "Has God really said" nonsense. Just tell him to talk to the hand. Answer doubt with truth from scripture, resist him and he will flee from you. He obviously knows what buttons to push on you, perhaps due to ocd, I don't know about that. But the simple fact is when the thoughts come up, that you can't be saved because you don't or didn't or do, or forgot ______, just stop right there. It's not about you. It's about Him. Jesus payment was sufficient. It's a gift. That's the truth, and He said who ever comes to Him He won't cast out, and that's the truth. He is The Truth. Don't entertain the enemy's junk. He just wants to steal your joy and make you miserable.

    I know man. I struggled the same way. It is scary. You don't need to fear. He makes you righteous. Believe. Trust.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    505

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tscopemkr View Post
    I have trouble with my salvation. I am going back and forth between being saved and going to hell for unbelief.

    Any thoughts or comments would be welcome at this point, I need help.
    Not unusual, not at all. I went through much the same thing myself at a point when I was younger. According to her official biography, apparently even legendary Southern Baptist missionary Lottie Moon was troubled by thoughts of her own inadequacy while on her deathbed, so it can happen to anyone.

    Normally it is Satan who baits you into thinking that you're unsaved. However, I also feel that God enjoys hearing you say that you do choose Him and that you want to be saved...especially if you say it while Satan is listening.

    So, whenever you get that insecure feeling, stop and pray that you do choose Jesus as Lord, and that if by some remote chance someone thinks you're not saved that you certainly want to be. Rinse and repeat as often as required, and at some point Satan will eventually take the hint. And you won't bother God at all, even if you do this every day for fifty years (although I think the necessity for that is HIGHLY unlikely...).
    --------Eric H. Bowen

    16 inch Armor Piercing: When you care enough to send the very, very, best!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    1,230

    Default

    You are not alone. I have struggled with this for years. Just recently I asked the Lord to give me assurance, help my unbelief. He has and is doing that in my mind and heart. I will tell you that I have gone back and forth just as you have and its awful. I started reading Jack Kelley's articles and I have been very blessed. I think my issue is unbelief. I do believe I have been saved but I don't believe what He says about me and salvation. I always worry I need to right my wrongs or do just the one thing to make sure that I am accepted. Its wrong and I am not believing His Word. I get worried when I read and it seems like I read that I have to someway contribute, like working out salvation, perservering, etc. Someone told me a few years ago that we don't need to throw out what we know because some scripture seems to contradict or doesn't make sense. I suggest reading and re-reading the scriptures you know about salvation. Stick to those for a while and let them sink in. Believe them. I am telling you this because I am going through and doing the same thing now. I will leave a few scriptures here that have been a blessing to me and I will pray for you I will add too that I do believe this is a form of OCD, although it does not make it any easier.

    Romans 4:5 And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness

    John 6:28-29 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
    29*Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

    Romans 4:24 *but for ours also. It will be counted to us who believe in him who raised from the dead Jesus our Lord, 25*who was delivered up for our trespasses and raised for our justification

    Romans 5:1 Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we[a] have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Romans 8:11 If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus[a] from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.

    Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.[a]

    Romans 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved

    John 6:37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.

    John 6:39-40 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. 40*For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day

    1 Corinthians 1:7-8 so that you are not lacking in any gift, as you wait for the revealing of our Lord Jesus Christ, 8*who will sustain you to the end, guiltless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Ephesians 1:13-14 *In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 14*who is the guarantee[a] of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it,[b] to the praise of his glory.

    Ephesians 2:13-14 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14*For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility

    Colossians 2:13-15 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14*by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. 15*He disarmed the rulers and authorities[a] and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.[b]

    Colossians 3:1-4 If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 2*Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth. 3*For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. 4*When Christ who is your[a] life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.

    2 Timothy 2:1 You then, my child, be strengthened by the grace that is in Christ Jesus

    Titus 3:4-7 But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, 5*he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, 6*whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7*so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life

    And finally and my prayer for you: Romans 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.

    Please pray and ask God to give you assurance and ask Him to help you believe His Word. He loves you.

    Here are Jack Kelleys articles http://www.raptureready.com/featured/kelley/kelley.html


    In particular http://www.raptureready.com/featured...y/jack377.html
    Above all else, guard your heart, for it is the wellspring of life~Proverbs 4:23

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    la la land UK
    Posts
    1,266

    Default

    DH struggled with this issue for many years. In the end, he would say it was torment for him. So eventually, when he used to talk about his fears, I'd start by simply saying to him - if you worry you aren't saved, then commit your life to the Lord right now & do something to rectify it! After numerous repeats of the same conversation, he started to think a little differently. Then he changed his aproach to his salvation slightly, but still fretted about it. So I encouraged him to think about the people he knew who weren't believers, & asked him how many times they had, knowing he is a believer, talked to him about where they might go when they die. How often they worried if they needed to be saved or not. He thought back to one couple we know who we've presented the gospel to numerous times & who still say that when your dead, that's it.
    After many examples of unsaved people we know, he began to realise they don't even think about their salvation or eternal destination. It is only something the believer worries about. It's unique to us. Have a chat to anyone who isn't saved & you'll see.
    Fortunately around the time DH started to realise he was saved, we joined a great house group in which the bible teacher spent the next 2 years in various studies that gave him complete confidence about his salvation.
    You really wouldn't be concerned about it if you weren't saved. But I do agree with others that Jack's site will help a great deal, there's a wealth of good teaching on this subject.
    For Thou art my hope, Oh Lord God Psalm 71:5
    Being confident of this very thing, that He who hath begun a good work in you, will perform it to the day of the Lord Philippians 1:6


    MY TABLET CANNOT TYPE OR SPELL

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    684

    Default Free Gift

    Free Gift

    Let's just use some simple logic.
    If I give you my car as a FREE GIFT and you accept it, then the title will be transferred from me to you and you will now own the car. Maybe later I decide I don't like how you are treating the car I gave you and I decide to take it back and then I do. You can now call the police and have me arrested, as the car is no longer mine and I have stolen your car!

    If God says that it is a FREE GIFT and requires anything other than acceptance, then there are only two choices. Either God does not use the logic that he himself created, or he is not being honest with us.

    How does the statement that you must WORK to attain a FREE GIFT make any sense? There is no honest person on earth who would expect you to work for a free gift. Is God less honest than we are?

    Romans 5:15 - But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many

    Romans 5:16 - And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

    Rom 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

    Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

    Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    Goodboy

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    la la land UK
    Posts
    1,266

    Default

    Also just another couple of points that may help, how do you view sin? Do you wince (like I do when I think of things I've done as a believer) do you regularly confess your sin.? I'm sure you do. Now go & ask an unbeliever about sin.....DH talks of a friend who was so upset when going through a difficult time, he had a bit too much to drink one night ( he was saved) . When he went into work the next day, he was very very down. His unsaved work collegues pushed him to tell them what was wrong & then spent all day mocking him for his remorse. They saw no wrong in what he'd done. When you say you cannot stand to be seperated from the Lord, again, the unsaved don't want any part of him. I know I didn't before I was saved. But now He's living in me, seperation from Him would be that unimaginable nightmare.
    My point is, sometimes looking at the unsaved can be a helpful barometer to see if we are different & inspite of our struggles our focus & priorities are different.
    DH is fed up with his work too & is seeking the Lord. He is faithful & has a plan even when we don't see it. That's when He comes right alongside us, when we seek Him in our dispair.
    For Thou art my hope, Oh Lord God Psalm 71:5
    Being confident of this very thing, that He who hath begun a good work in you, will perform it to the day of the Lord Philippians 1:6


    MY TABLET CANNOT TYPE OR SPELL

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •