February 4th, 2009, 04:50 PM
This dad has a problem with defiant sons
I am a 46 year old Christian dad divorced(she divorced me) with 2 sons 16 and 13.oldest is 6 foot 3 and 225 and youngest is 5 foot 11 and 220.I am 5 foot 9 and 240.
For over a year and a half, both my sons ,especially the youngest have gotten more defiant. my youngest is failing the 7th grade and is happy about it, been in in-school detention several times.
They both got involved in world of warcraft 11/07. They play it nonstop at there home and come to mine playing it. It has become an obsession with them wrapped up in raids and guilds. I play it some to have something to share with them.
whenever i tell them to go to bed, i get the reply "no i cant ive got to finish this , my guild will kick me out".when i try to turn off the computer the youngest has knocked my hand out the way.When i try to take them out to eat..."when will we be back, my raid is at 7
The youngest has also kicked my storm door to get out of the house and when my wife said something to him..he told her to get a new one.he has also booted my dog off the couch twice and used the side of his foot to knock him out of his way.
on friday he told me he was failing. he also told me he wore shorts to school with the zipper broke. I had told him to bring some clothes so we could go out to eat sunday afternoon(they refuse to go to church with me on sundays...mom said we dont have to when we are with you)I had numerous incidents on saturday with him..my wife and I talked to both og them told them we love them but that we have to have more respect for us, our property and our dog.
when i told him to go to bed, he asked what are we going to do tomorrow. i answered "i told you...go out to eat maybe go to a movie. He answered " i didnt bring any clothes".In the 8 years since the divorced , i have only "spanked" him 3 times. Once was with myhand on his legs. he thought that was funny, once was 2 slaps on his back with a belt( he moved that time) and saturday night with my hand on his shoulders 7 times. he got up ,got his bag, told me to get the #$%^ out of his way and got his brother to take him home. The next day I had a assault and battery charge given to me.
just to let you know..exwife is extremely nonsupportive.. if i had mentioned counseling to her she would have brushed it off. In fact when i did email her about his behaviour she said" he is fine just growing up and trying us"
Any ideas, suggestions , support?
February 4th, 2009, 06:58 PM
Brother, I wish I had some wise words for you. I know that you love your sons and that this is tearing you apart and you don't know what to do. My son is younger and he has gotten himself wrapped into playing some internet games such as spore and roblox. I've had to take away all his computer games a few times because of his attitude or his disregard for what he should be doing. It's kind of hard to do that with sons the ages of yours and not have it all go up in smoke or have them packing. It seems lame to say, but I have lifted you up in prayer.
February 4th, 2009, 06:58 PM
I don't know what to tell you about raising kids because I do not have any of my own
but I do have experience being addicted to MMORPG's and both of your sons are
addicted. I pretty much failed High school due to Everquest which is pretty much the
same as WoW and I finally quite once I seen that I wasted 2-3 years of my life for a
virtual life and virtual material. If this addiction continues with your sons they will
experience problems coping in the real world because of social problems and it does not
matter where there social skills are at currently. You need to get them help and get
them involved in outdoor activity's that have face to face interactions like fishing or
some other sport. This addiction is very very serious and I would put it on par with
alcoholism and gambling addictions. Please do not ignore this problem because it will only
get worse and worse. You will also need there mother to be in agreement with what ever
action you take to correct this. I pray you get help and fix this problem some how.
February 4th, 2009, 07:30 PM
Start by taking the games away!
February 4th, 2009, 07:56 PM
At their age and size, it is too late for physical discipline. My guess is to get rid of the computer games which are causing the trouble. You are all living a lifestyle that is too sedentary.
i would suggest that when/if the the assault business is sorted out, that you and your sons get physical. Go cycling, walking, running, fishing, anything, but get moving when you have them. This will help you and them feel better and give you some common interests.
February 4th, 2009, 08:28 PM
Spanking is now virtually outlawed.
Soon Scripture will be as well.
This verse does not speak of physical things, but it does come to mind...
Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.
February 4th, 2009, 09:04 PM
There has been good feedback and i thank you. Velyx is correct in that they are so addicted they are neglecting school, me ,even not brushing teeth or taking a bath.During christmas break they rarely bathed.taking the games isnt as easy as it sounds because if you do that they take a hike as brokenjar stated.
I want to get them into christian counseling and myself as well. how i get them there is the problem.The mom is in denial and uncooperative.
As far as the court situation,my attorney thinks it will be thrown out due to real lack of injury to the child. spanking is not illegal in virginia but abuse is based upon several factors and he was mainly fired up and his mom talked him into doing it.
February 4th, 2009, 09:11 PM
I know based on experience from having (still feel it now) an internet addiction how bad it can be, the best way is just to keep laying down the laws of the house. My parents had to do that with me many times until I finally got it; I am not perfect, but I am definitely better for my parents decision.
February 9th, 2009, 02:23 PM
AT what age can a child choose where they live? In PA it is 14. If it is high you could push the issue that you ex is endangering the well being of the kids (ie school problems) Have you contacted children in youth? With only haveing partial custody all that you do maybe voided. I recomend in your situation dont ever hit them. DUe to what you just deal with rather deal with things like shutting the game down until they can prove they have chnaged. Mom can not deny your rights and denying them to play doesn't hurt them. If they get violate threan them, that you will call the cops and if they hit you or your wife, call the cops. I know it isn't easy but sometimes kids need a "wake up" call. If they become violent be sure your ex could/can be investaged. The law in PA is very strict here in regards to the childrens well being. Just a couple of thoughts from what I know.
February 9th, 2009, 03:56 PM
I cannot tell from your post who pays for their subscriptions, however, I know that WOW has a parental control section on their website which allows the parent or guardian of a minor to control when the child can play the game. If it is your ex-wife or oldest child paying for the account it will be harder, but you may want to see if you can negotiate with her to use that function to limit their access to the game.
February 10th, 2009, 11:09 AM
I may be a bit extreem but I have pretty good control in my house. You need to flat out take control of your house...you have lost control. Lock down the computer throw away the game. This may sound silly and childish but if you don't care about the computer smash it with a bat right infront of them and let them know you mean business next time they refuse to go to bed. I guarentee they will not mess with you.
A lot of people including me get really irritable when being desturbed from playing games. Look how many people kill their kids because they disturbed their video game. I had to finally sell my gaming computer to break my addiction.
As a father though you need to lay down the law if they want to get physical and your can't handle it call the cops and let them know you mean business. IMO you gain respect when they fear you...im talking healthy Godly fear not abusing type of fear but if they need a good beat down DO IT. It's no different when people lose fear of God they become defiant and disrespectful. Sometimes God needs to smack us with real life and wake us up.
I will continue to spank my kids...They have threatned me to call the cops and I told them if they want to call the cops on me go right ahead because they will be finding a new place to live (aka foster home). I even dialed it for them and handed them the phone they freaked out and hung up real quick.
Thats my advice to you...take control now or they will be walking all over you because they know your a pushover.
February 10th, 2009, 01:01 PM
Please understand that I know nothing about online gaming, however, I do agree that you need to take control.
Assuming that you can password protect your computer, change the password to a secure password and donít tell the kids. Thus, they can not log on unless you log on for them.
Second, figure out which electrical breaker controls the power to the computer. Then if they do not stop ON THE FIRST DIRECTION TO SO FROM YOU, just calmly go to the electrical box and flip the breaker. Do not argue, do not plead, do not ask a second time. Just flip the switch - No power, no game, no fuss. Assuming it is like most computers, then when YOU turn the power back on you will to re-enter the password. The game is over until you decide to enter the password.
This may damage the computer, but it may be the price you have to pay.
February 10th, 2009, 08:49 PM
funny thing is when i tried to take control , i end up with an assault and battery charge...just today(a week and a half after the incident) i just got arrested again as i guess my exwife has talked my 16 year old to file an assault charge against me....now i have 2 misdemeanors...there is no way this can go through because i never touched nor threatened him...after I spanked the 13 years old( legal legal) the 16 year old ran in the room with eyes blaring and an aggressive posture with fists clenched..i asked him "what do you think you are going to do?". he told the magistrate i challenged him to fight....anyone see that in my statement? No..i thought not! thats all i said to him.
The exwife is milking this situation and trying to turn the children against me that last little bit. I guess she talked the 16 year old into this yesterday.
what i would have like to have done was tell the exwife 2 or three months ago when they got more and more out of control that i would like them to go to counseling.i sent her emails and she brushed them off..so she would have said no to that too.
the punishment was a last ditch effort to show the child that i meant business. intent was to get his attention not beat the @#$% out of him. that is my christian right to punish my child and if i am convicted im appealing this. I will NOT have my parental rights and my beliefs taken lightly.....my child will NOT kick my dog, kick my storm door in, tell me no to everything I ask of him laughing and get away with it.
February 10th, 2009, 08:54 PM
Oh and the way im seeing it now..i dont think my 2 sons appear to have any intent to come back to my home. but they have been brainwashed by my exwife and her 3 sisters for 8 years....so i think im starting to now see the whole picture. god wants families to be together and in the end of times it is said that brother would turn on brother....people its happening and not just to me.....families are in turmoil everywhere....
February 11th, 2009, 10:37 AM
Im sorry for you pain man ...YOU DID THE RIGHT THING. It is probably better to just get them out of your house then and just not be bothered by it....give your ex full control and just seperate yourself from them until they mature and realize their ways and always Pray for them.
February 11th, 2009, 03:13 PM
today i got kicked to the curb by my counselor before I even seen him....seems the exwife picked the same person I did..... the boys saw him first..now he calls it a conflict of interest. i cant even see another person in the practice...had to find another christian counseling service.
I would think the guy would have wanted to counsel all of us separately and then try to bring us together ..but oh what do i know!!!!
February 11th, 2009, 07:05 PM
Well, let me chime in on the game issue.
They are addicting. I use to play a game called Ultima Online as well as several others. They can become a problem. I played UO for over 4 years sometimes for an allmost 24 hour period. Mind you I paid my bills, never missed work or anything like that but I had no social life outside the game.
As far as defiant kids, I have 4 stepkids, 3 boys and 1 girl. Never had much problem out of the oldest who is now 19 other than 1 time where I caught him bringing in pot in the house. It nearly came to blows but after the cops were called and they found out I was not a dealer, they asked if he could come back in and the wife and i said ok...he apologized and all was good.
The girl is a different story. She turned 18, found the first guy she could hook up with and got pregnant and one of the boys is a complusive liar and thief.
I told them when they first moved in if they ever raised a hand to me or my wife it would be the last time it would happen.
The girl tried that once and before she knew it she was on the ground.
Boy double up his fists once at me, of course I told him go ahead one free shot then it's on.
Its bad anymore, and your right you can't even disipline your kids without someone screaming child abuse.
I pray every day for strength, and so far God's not let me down.
I will pray for you brother. Have faith in God to resolve this.
February 12th, 2009, 09:02 AM
Okay, as a parent of a deviant child here are some things I wish to impart to you. Get rid of the games, computers, etc when the children are there. If they come for a visit make it clear that there are some house rules. Be sure to make up the house rules beforehand. If they cannot and will not obey these rules they are not allowed in your house. The boys are too big for physical contact, plus it sounds as if they will use the courts to get back at you. Tough love is needed and probably the only thing that will ensure these young men any type of a life. Have you thought to have them tested for drugs? Most of the time when kids are acting out in this way they have an addiction to something, not always but majority of the time. Doesn't sound as if the ex is going to be of any help. So, as bad as this sounds give them to her to handle. You seek counseling and stand firm.
February 15th, 2009, 10:44 AM
Sometimes you have to do the tough love. I had problems with one of my kids where some tough love was necessary. Sometimes you just have to stand your ground, let them go, and trust God to bring them around. Sometimes that can take awhile. I'd recommend changing the passwords on the PC and maybe uninstalling the games (assuming it's your computer). If the game has a subscription and it's paid by your card, kill the payments or change your card. You can't force them to stop playing but you can stop having a part in their choice. Pray hard, love them, wait long, and trust God even when it seems like nothing has happened or will happen.
February 15th, 2009, 04:21 PM
The deal is I might not have them back over here again. I truely believe that my exwife(who just got remarried 3 weeks ago) is using this to stop the visitation and have have her "perfect family" with the new husband.
If I am found guilty( which I cant see how that will happen), it will make things easier for her to take away visitation and move the children to his state (north carolina).